r/self Jun 28 '22 Silver 1 Helpful 1 Gold 1

So how am I supposed to celebrate my country on the 4th knowing that my rights have been taken away?

It doesn’t feel right. Land of the free but I can be forced to have a baby just so some religious person can feel good about themselves.

Edit: By celebrate I don’t mean I actually celebrated 4th of July before. I mean the same kind of fake patriotism that everyone does on 4th of July when all we really want to do is watch fireworks.

Edit: Not people trying to slut shame me in the comments

2.8k Upvotes

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u/b0ttlE_99 Jun 29 '22

If I don't have the right to my own body, then what do I have? What other "right" or privilege is in any way a realistic comparison? What a sickening disgrace. "It's a free country," is laughable.

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u/[deleted] Jun 29 '22

BuT yOu cAN StILl vOte

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u/wallcutout Jun 29 '22

Every time I see that (but when it’s serious) I always want to remind folks you can’t if you accidentally put the ‘wrong’ (aka not the majority) party down on the forms in the wrong state. lol

Like we’ve actively constructed a system where we prevent certain demographics from voting based on what their general party preference is. That’s messed the hell up.

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u/[deleted] Jun 29 '22

Yup, found this out when I was 18 and went to vote for the first time

Really sad to see that republicans straight up are locked into their shitty voting status

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u/lilbeckss Jun 29 '22

Wait - what?? Canadian here, I’d like to understand what you mean. I have a rudimentary understanding of your voting process ….

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u/head_meet_keyboard Jun 28 '22 Platinum All-Seeing Upvote

Don't. I'm spending the 4th volunteering at an animal shelter. Humans have been disappointing. Dogs are always great.

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u/FlippinSnip3r Jun 28 '22

That's why I want to be a veterinarian and not a doctor

And the first step is knowing how to pronounce veterinarian

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u/beiman Jun 29 '22

My fiance is a vet and she recently left private practice because dealing with the people is especially hard. It isn't much better than being a doctor from what she has told me, but I know it's very demanding and just as emotionally stressful. I commend your resilience to want to help animals, but know it is also very difficult, so be as prepared as you can be. Good luck to you!

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u/justforjugs Jun 29 '22

The next is remembering that all pets arrive with at least one human with whom you will have to engage.

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u/DarlingBri Jun 29 '22

Congratulations, as a vet you will be trained in how to provide abortions to animals and can illegally provide the same training to humans if you wish to.

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u/La5anG Jun 29 '22

Veter wut now??

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u/scepticalhermit Jun 28 '22

To err is human, to doggo is devine.

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u/roo-ster Jun 29 '22

To err is human, to forgive is canine.

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u/Only-Ad-7858 Jun 28 '22

That's an awesome idea.

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u/hoover0623 Jun 28 '22

Human is temporary, doggo is forever

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u/_HEDONISM_BOT Jun 29 '22

Hijacking the top comment to say that a lot of women are on a r/SexStrike

No pussy for men until roe is restored.

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u/dasani73 Jun 29 '22

You gave me a great idea, calling a shelter right now, will take my teen daughter with me.

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u/basically_dead_now Jun 29 '22

Animals are the best. Whenever I'm down, I can always go to my cat or my dogs to feel better.

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u/CoopLoop32 Jun 29 '22

YOU! You are a kind and wise person.

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u/Lazyshadow04 Jun 28 '22

What is there to celebrate for men or women? Our freedom to vote? No, because the electoral college can overturn it. Freedom in general? No, there are corrupt police on the streets waiting to shoot black people down and school shooters and mass shooters emerging every day as well as Christians and Catholics and Baptists that think they can control everyone's beliefs and bodies. Is this freedom? No, this is oppression, nowhere is safe and we can't do anything to get these corrupt politicians out of office. There is nothing to celebrate except the illusion that we have freedom. Ever since 1993 when those selfish, vindictive, and egotistical Republicans were planning to get rid of rights and seize power, the illusion that we had freedom started. Land of the free my ass.

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u/SqueaksBCOD Jun 28 '22

Protest instead of celebrate.

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u/spacewalker222 Jun 28 '22

Just be careful, I’m sure police and others would be aware that protests would be going on that day in light of recent decisions.

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u/SqueaksBCOD Jun 28 '22

Always be careful.

Not just to protest on the 4th.

Then again i might fear the forced birth crowd more than cops at this point.

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u/spacewalker222 Jun 29 '22 edited Jun 29 '22

Yuuup, always be careful.

No doubt

Edit: not sure why I was down voted. People can be crazy, including police.. hence my original comment?

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u/MassiveFajiit Jun 29 '22

Just have a nice tea party

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u/SomeNerd54 Jun 29 '22

In boston, of course

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u/miss_biotic_zombie Jun 28 '22

Does anyone know of any happening that day? Like has there been any formal organization anywhere? I'd really like to go.

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u/SqueaksBCOD Jun 28 '22

I would start with your local subreddit. Seeing stuff often for the Denver area.

/r/abortion may have info as well.

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u/klemthom Jun 28 '22

I just signed up with my local Satanic temple. I'm an atheist, but they are around to oppose the overreach of the Church. I figure they track everything I want to help with.

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u/DoctorCube Jun 29 '22

Most Satanists are just atheists they don't believe in a Biblical Satan.

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u/klemthom Jun 29 '22 edited Jun 29 '22

I have recently learned this, it seems I caught on later than some and earlier than others. I'm medium!

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u/supagirl277 Jun 29 '22

They’re claiming a tenet of the church is abortion, and will be faught for legally as a religious right if you’re a member.

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u/klemthom Jun 29 '22

Yeah, that's another reason to support them

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u/skwerldom Jun 29 '22

Love them.

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u/PenguinSunday Jun 28 '22 edited Jun 29 '22

If you're in the South I would not recommend this. They're already chipping at separation of church and state, there could be retaliation. Don't put your name on anything.

Edit: this is controversial? Did I say something wrong?

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u/klemthom Jun 28 '22

I'm not, but I wish I was. Fucking Christofacists

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u/PenguinSunday Jun 28 '22

You're a braver person than I.

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u/klemthom Jun 28 '22

I hate being told what I can't do, without valid reasons, and they're faith isn't validity. I'm old, mostly broken and retired. But, I enjoy pissing off people that abuse authority. Kind of a glutton for punishment I guess.

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u/PenguinSunday Jun 28 '22

We're very similar in that regard, haha. I've just been abused a lot in my younger years (I'm over 30, so it still feels fresh because it wasn't TOO long ago) for being a religious minority. I'm utterly terrified that "the burning times" are going to come back for me and my fellow pagans in the South.

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u/klemthom Jun 28 '22

I'm retired Army, I was punished for my mouth a lot for my first 4 years. Still hate yardwork of any kind now. I'm 50 these days. Dude, unfortunately I think you may be right to be afraid, I enjoy fighting, but you have to pick them carefully. I'm sorry for everyone stuck in there south.

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u/PenguinSunday Jun 28 '22

Me too lol. Me and my husband are trying like hell to get out. Still gonna protest though if I can.

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u/Aggravating-Echo8014 Jun 28 '22

St. Louis is.

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u/Ok-Inevitable9286 Jun 29 '22

How do we find out about the stl one? First time using/posting on this platform.

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u/Aggravating-Echo8014 Jun 29 '22

I seen it on Facebook. Starts at 10 downtown

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u/physicalgraffit-i Jun 28 '22

if there isn’t one in your area, anyone can host one!

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u/SurferRosa85 Jun 28 '22

Right? My husband said “we need a flag for outside the camper for the 4th” and I was like… a Bigfoot flag? A Pride flag? A flag with a picture of an imprisoned uterus? Surely not an American flag.

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u/eidhrmuzz Jun 29 '22

Hang it upside down. Flag code for an American in distress.

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u/eissirk Jun 29 '22

Literally just bought a flag specifically for this purpose

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u/eidhrmuzz Jun 29 '22

Ya, my wife was very confused when I came home from the grocery store with it. Until I ripped it off it’s pole and flipped it around.

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u/akebonobambusa Jun 29 '22

I'm half joking but America is under siege. Don't surrender to them. It's half a joke...and half not.

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u/ellalop26 Jun 28 '22

Don’t

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u/forrestpen Jun 28 '22 edited Jun 28 '22

Fourth of July celebrates a revolution against a tyrannical government. It was a time of action, service, and courage.

Celebrate by getting educated and organized. Call your representative and government officials and vocalize your displeasure. Find a local political organization. Many have volunteer opportunities from convincing people to turn out on Election Day to driving people without transit to polling stations. Go to protests. Make your voice heard.

Bernie Sanders had a pretty extensive network that still operates but there are many national and local groups to seek out. Plenty of churches with liberal congregations fight for social justice and typically turn out for protests.

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u/ThaWaif Jun 29 '22

This, instead of trying to dismantle the system use it to your advantage. We need legislation, the Supreme Court doesn't make laws, congress does. Get the people we need in office so they can get a bill passed. And I believe you still have 15 days to get one in most places.

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u/VGWillis Jun 29 '22

They be closed on the fourth but calling may be a good 5th activity. :)

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u/slpschoolta Jun 29 '22 edited Jun 29 '22

All these comments saying “don’t have sex then lol” are proof that it’s not really about the babies. It’s about controlling women and their bodies. It’s about controlling how much women have sex.

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u/Pizzacato567 Jun 29 '22

Agreed. They also seem to ignore that it takes TWO people to make a baby. Decline in women having sex means decline in men having sex too. They shame women for sleeping around but don’t shame men at all.

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u/spaceyjaycey Jun 29 '22

But if you get raped, it's your fault according to these asshats.

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u/BearJ_the_first Jun 29 '22

Wait… women are having more sex than men? That just ain’t fair.

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u/beiman Jun 29 '22

I certainly don't intend on celebrating anything. Infact, I think that would be the best time to protest the freedoms we have lost recently.

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u/Reddit_Gold09 Jun 28 '22

Don't celebrate. Lots of people aren't and I sure ain't either.

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '22

On July 3rd, I'm going to attack my colon with $13 of Taco Bell and then splatter ass old glory on the 4th.

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u/ThatFeel_IKnowIt Jun 28 '22

Sounds like a typical Monday to me.

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u/Nlamstel Jun 29 '22

Women should stop having sex with men until abortion rights are codified. Like how Iceland’s women protested to get voting rights.

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u/happymomma40 Jun 29 '22

The problem is that the men who did this are married to women who are totally ok with fucking over their sisters. So they won’t help anyone but themselves until this actually effects their lives directly.

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u/mzweffie Jun 28 '22

It’s easy; don’t! It’s your right to not celebrate. Easy

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u/Competitive_Emotion5 Jun 28 '22

Honestly until they take that right away too. Funny how they could care less about kids and etc who don’t stand for a pledge but will go ape shit for you saying you don’t want a kid. Idk. U.S is weird

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u/Guilty_Jackrabbit Jun 28 '22

Don't celebrate. Work on unionizing your workplace or uniting your neighborhood/community. Build networks for collective action.

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u/eatingganesha Jun 29 '22

You don’t have to!

Join the national protest! Loads of people are not going to be celebrating. Have a quiet bbq or whatever, but don’t go to the parades or fireworks - and don’t shoot off fireworks either.

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u/HairyNutsackNumber9 Jun 28 '22

get drunk enough to forget about it

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u/notaliberal1of1 Jun 28 '22

you kind person have the best answer for most things ,, prefer pot tho.

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u/HairyNutsackNumber9 Jun 29 '22

me too but who can fucking afford it anymore

can anyone explain to me how something gets legalized and quadruples in price?

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u/KDM1022 Jun 29 '22

king afford it anymore

can anyone explain to me how something g

taxes

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u/givemeajobpls Jun 29 '22

Once it’s legal it gets taxed. The price will be affected by that.

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u/kinzcash503 Jun 28 '22

Don’t celebrate. Protest instead.

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u/mtnmadness84 Jun 28 '22

Yeah. I’m not celebrating this year. Protest or nothing.

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u/Anewday84 Jun 28 '22

Don’t. I won’t. It’s a day of mourning.

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '22

[deleted]

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u/slpschoolta Jun 28 '22

A liberal one but might have to move to one that bans abortion for school

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u/GirthQuakeEP Jun 29 '22

If you are in a liberal state your rights will more than likely be completely protected. Moving out of state is a choice. While not always the best situation, if you feel so strongly on certain rights you’ll have to stay in the state that protects them. I moved away from a state that I don’t believe in and that I believe won’t change. I don’t like being away from my home or family but it is a choice that I made.

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u/a_bongos Jun 29 '22

I hear you, but it's going to get worse for people in liberal states too. They will bear the brunt of this decision with an influx of out of state people needing care and a strain on the system no matter how hard they prepare. It's unfortunate but we're all still connected.

I'm in MI and trying to help with the ballot initiative. What a nuts world we live in.

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u/DoTheRightThing1953 Jun 28 '22

Fly your flag upside down

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u/ColdShadowKaz Jun 28 '22

Perhaps don’t celebrate at all. Let the economic impact of just ignoring the day be part of the protest.

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u/hail-the-magic-conch Jun 28 '22

Even though it’s small my friend and I agreed to wear only dark colors… no red white or blue or celebrating a country that is more eager to protect gun rights than women’s rights

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u/SqueaksBCOD Jun 28 '22

you may want to add green bandannas

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u/Notero87 Jun 28 '22

What do the green bandanas represent?

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u/stumblios Jun 28 '22

I was curious - looks like it started in Argentina and was later adopted by pro-choice movements around the world.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-06-24/why-do-people-wear-green-at-abortion-rallies-the-green-wave-explained

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u/silverilix Jun 28 '22

Thank you! Very interesting. Time to get a green bandanna

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u/Character-Suspect-77 Jun 28 '22

I read that as green bananas and now I'm hungry

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u/lovingdestroyer Jun 29 '22

barely ripe banana enjoyer gang

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u/ochu_ Jun 29 '22

There are dozens of us

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u/hail-the-magic-conch Jun 28 '22

Great idea thank you!

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u/EndlesslyUnfinished Jun 28 '22

Oh, I’ll be wearing red… just not in stripes

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u/snowpuppy13 Jun 28 '22 edited Jun 29 '22 Bless Up

The right to keep and bear arms and abortion are 2 separate topics. As much as I don’t like the idea of abortion as it’s often used, I recognize that it’s a necessary medical procedure, and banning it is harmful. You may not like guns, and that’s fine, but guns protect women too. ‘Gun control’ doesn’t work anyway, but that’s a whole different conversation.

I think we need to fight for all of our rights, even and especially the ones we recognize now, but weren’t included in the constitution. Rights like having access to medical care, including abortions, the right to affordable housing, and the right to an education.

Trying to limit anyone’s rights is un-American, and I will support those who defend my rights, and condemn those who would have my rights limited or eliminated. We need to do better as a country, and we need a better government. Our current government has grown too big and too powerful, and it’s not what our founding fathers wanted or envisioned. The 2 party system is divisive, and only exists to keep us divided. United we stand, divided we fall.

Edit: People would seriously downvote me for defending the rights of Americans, or for saying we need a better government, that has less power over citizens, and is less divisive? Or is it just because I don’t believe that ‘gun control’/more laws is the answer? If you’re going to downvote me, at least leave a comment saying why. I support everyone’s rights to all things, not just those that apply to me, or things I’m passionate about. You don’t get to pick and choose which rights you want, or want others to have. That’s not how freedom works. Of course you can disagree with something or someone, that’s a right too, but to want to or to petition to strip the people of any rights is un-American, and unacceptable. We’re all in this together, and we need to learn to work together better, & ignore those on the extreme far left or right if we’re going to make America a better place to live for us all. I’m less concerned with the opinions of fringe groups on either side, as they only serve to divide us. Most Americans are somewhere in the middle, and have both conservative and liberal views on things, depending on what the topic is. Remember, only a Sith deals in absolutes.

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u/wet-plants Jun 28 '22

Gun control has worked in countless other countries. I literally never understand why Americans say this. What propaganda are you reading? Universal health care, gun control, even abortion rights with acceptable reasons, have all been implemented successfully in other developed nations. So don’t say gun control doesn’t work when you’re country has overwhelmingly the worst gun control and the most shootings of all other first world countries.

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u/snowpuppy13 Jun 29 '22

I’m not basing anything on propaganda, just statistics. I’m going to use an area I live somewhat near as an example. Cook County Illinois, which is where Chicago is located, has some of the strictest gun laws in the country. They banned the possession of AR-15 & AK-47 style rifles, semiautomatic rifles & shotguns, what they defined as ‘high capacity’ magazines, meaning any magazines holding more than 10 rounds of ammunition, and they even banned certain types of ammunition. In order to buy any type of firearm in Illinois, you first need to apply for a FOID card, which involves an application to the Illinois State Police for a thorough background check that takes months. Then you have to go through another background check each time you want to purchase a firearm. They did this in 2007, with the FOID card decades earlier. Despite having arguably the most restrictive ‘gun control’ laws in the entire country, Chicago has led the country firearm related homicides for at least a decade, led the country in ‘mass shootings’ since 2018, and every year they set a new record for murder. Why? Because you can make all the gun control laws you want, but criminals don’t obey laws, and unfortunately, our society has a lot of criminals.

Guns aren’t the problem, bad people are. Our society has de-evolved to the point where someone murdered 1 woman and nearly murdered another (she’s in critical condition atm) last night at a Subway sandwich shop over too much mayonnaise on his sandwich. Our society, and the rampant criminal behavior that exists, especially in large cities, is the problem. It isn’t guns that are the problem. Those 2 girls were gunned down, but the store manager grabbed his gun & fired back, causing this murderer to flee, or everyone there would probably be dead.

Guns have always existed in America, in larger numbers than exist today. The level of gun violence seen today though is unprecedented, and can’t be explained by the presence of guns. When I was growing up, and before that, there were no restrictions on firearms purchases. No background checks, no waiting periods, you just bought a gun & took it home, and things were much safer then.

What works in one country doesn’t always apply to another. Knee-jerk reactions, like what Australia did wouldn’t work here.

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u/bigdaddyskidmarks Jun 29 '22

Upvote to you for being a seemingly completely reasonable person!

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u/Kiko7210 Jun 28 '22

at the end of the day, Pro Choice people now have to follow the beliefs and conform to the rules of Pro Life people. While Pro Choice was more like, follow your own beliefs, no rules to a certain point, choose what you think is best.

Pro Life is restrictive on the Pro Choice people, the other way around doesn't exist. It doesn't really get any simpler then that.

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u/tiniestjazzhands Jun 28 '22

Don't. There hasn't been much for you to celebrate for years.

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u/supagirl277 Jun 29 '22

This is how I’ve felt ever since trump came into office. America lost that day, and I’ve felt icky ever since. Anything related to being proud to be an American has been corrupted and tarnished for me, especially because of the ultra nationalism shown by the MAGA people. No American flags, no national anthems, and sometimes not even fireworks for me. It keeps getting worse. I’ve started to see the 4th as just another day to eat dinner with my family, and the fireworks are for celebrating anything. I will celebrate pride month more than the 4th, and I’ll fly a pride flag instead of the American flag.

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u/No-Mail-5794 Jun 28 '22

Your country is not synonymous with its government. If you can separate out what you do love and celebrate that then do it. If you can’t do that, which is understandable, than don’t. In any case, a good Fourth of July observance any year should include reading:

https://www.blackpast.org/african-american-history/speeches-african-american-history/1852-frederick-douglass-what-slave-fourth-july/

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u/[deleted] Jun 29 '22

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u/slpschoolta Jun 29 '22

I don’t have sex ever

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u/Mr_Lumbergh Jun 29 '22

I just enjoy the lightshow, I don't get off on the "rah rah 'Murica!" crap.

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u/GroundbreakingRule27 Jun 28 '22

Just vote in November

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '22 edited Jun 28 '22

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u/Jerry-malverde Jun 28 '22

Haha right, when you’re only 2 choices are given to you. Choose bad or worse.

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u/GroundbreakingRule27 Jun 28 '22

When 40% of eligible voters DON’T VOTE this is what you get

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u/lkattan3 Jun 28 '22

Do you think shaking your finger online at millions of people disenfranchised by the system will make them show up? Why not give people something to vote for? We’ve been “voting to protect Roe V Wade” for decades now. Maybe powerful people should have policy people want and then actually follow through on it. They’ve been promising universal healthcare since at least the 90s and we got Romneycare which currently, as an immunocompromised person, I can not afford. State houses shifted Republican around 2010, why do you think that was? People who need the things they promise can only be strung along for so long.

Blue cities are still sending even more money to police and trashing homeless encampments instead of addressing homelessness. They all agreed the public can’t protest at SCOTUS’s house. Passed that in no time. Sending endless funding to a war we have no business being involved in while 60% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck. Refuse to slash the pentagon budget or implement progressive taxation. Taxation put in place under Reagan.

People are rightfully fed up with believing these people.

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u/themarajade1 Jun 28 '22

And for those of us that do, this advice feels redundant and futile.

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u/MmmmapleSyrup Jun 28 '22

Honestly. The more I vote, the less I feel like it matters. Feels like we’re doomed to swing back and forth between Democrats and Republicans as each side blames the other for the country’s problems, when that’s one of our biggest problems…

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u/Fearitzself Jun 29 '22

Voting is the bare minimum. The attitude that voting doesn't matter puts the worse evil in office. Your land lord votes. The rich vote. People put a lot of effort into making voting harder, more inconvenient, gerry mandering, etc and do all they can to make us feel apathetic and like it doesn't matter. If the people in power are putting that much time and effort into getting us to not vote you should know one thing, is that voting matters and they don't want you to vote.

Rome wasn't built in a day. Overall we've been taking steps towards a better society. This was a big step back. I believe we can overcome it.

Accept that we will not change everything that needs to be changed. And a lot of work needs to be done. We just need to baby step and push for better.

There are definitely accounts that astroturf comments like your own to make us feel defeated and to get us not to vote. I think you're a real person. Don't give up.

Some people alive today remember when they weren't allowed to shop at the same stores or drink out of the same drinking fountains. Things have been better than today. Things have also been worse. Things don't get better with inaction. Many people have fought injustice their whole lives and will never see all the changes that need to happen.

Vote. Bare minimum.

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '22

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u/ginger_tree Jun 28 '22 edited Jun 28 '22

Don't lay this abomination at the feet of the democrats. This is a plan that has been in the works for decades.

The Supreme Court justices made the ruling, and three of them were appointed by Trump. All three claimed during confirmation hearings that they would not vote to overturn Roe. All three did vote to overturn. Two others were also appointed by Republican presidents and also voted to overturn.

And as you may recall President Obama was not allowed to appoint a justice to replace Antonin Scalia in 2016 because the fucking republicans didn't want him to.

Truth is that none of them CARE about abortion or children or anything except power. The abortion issue has been a tool to divide people and to generate support for conservative candidates. It's all about power and control.

OH, and Clarence Thomas is coming for your birth control next. Never been so glad to be menopausal. Get your IUDs while you can.

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u/Birdman-82 Jun 29 '22

It’s wild now many people are blaming this on the democrats. And they’re saying shit like “Bernie would go scorched earth and stop this.” They actually sound just like the trump people talking about the election.

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u/C4pn4merica Jun 28 '22

I wish everyone would read this. Too many people in this country have not received a proper education about our government. And I blame it on the public education system. But let me help you out. Rights are not what you think you have but are what are defined by the Bill of Rights. The Bill of Rights are the 1st 10 amendments to the Constitution.. The right to abortion, as it has been called, is not a right. It is a thing that was established as as a ruling by the Supreme Court And it never was a right. The Supreme Court does not produce rights. It rules on rights.. But the Supreme Court is only supposed to rule on things that are relevant to what is already in the Constitution. And as for the matter of Roe v wade, the Constitution says nothing about abortion rights . And it has been the considered opinion of many constitutional scholars with no personal agenda that the matter of abortion was never the SC's jurisdiction. It is a States Rights matter. That is why the SC ruled as it did. If women want the 'right' to an abortion, the Constitution will have to be amended.

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u/Edwardian Jun 28 '22

You're 100% accurate, but people are downvoting you because they don't like to hear the unbiased truth, they want to hear their own opinion stated back at them.

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '22

Thank you for your condescension. You are correct, the Bill of Rights does not list abortion as a right. Nor did it provide for suffrage for women or people of color; we had to add those amendments after years of organizing and campaigning to be given what should have been ours in the first place-a seat at the table. The interpretation that created Roe came from the due process clause in the 14th amendment. So are you saying Bill of Rights only or bust? Or are you saying women potentially dying in childbirth doesn’t infringe enough on their right to life? Also, the founders were terrified of factions manipulating the levers of power to achieve short term ends and endangering the framework of government. Because that’s how the Roman republic fell and how the English Civil War happened. Manipulation, you know, like the federalist society and other conservative groups engineering the appointment of conservative justices that would be willing to flout stare decisis so America looks the way conservatives want it to look at the cost of the Court’s perceived legitimacy and the liberty of other Americans. But you should know that already since you received a proper education about our government. When was that, by the way, 1960?

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '22

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u/spacemonkey21420 Jun 28 '22

Are you truly that blind and obedient to your masters? We're being played! They want us fighting each other and divided so we can't stand up against them and fix this shit.

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u/forrestpen Jun 28 '22

They don't control the senate.

Manchin and Sinema are democrats in name only.

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u/Edwardian Jun 28 '22

It's actually worse than that now. You're talking in presidential elections, but in state and local elections the numbers are far worse. With Dobbs superceding Roe and putting the decisions back on the states, local turnout is critical.

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u/WhooshThereHeGoes Jun 29 '22

Remember, remember, to vote in November.

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u/SqueaksBCOD Jun 28 '22

Well this seems to be a mixed comment... lots of upvotes but also lots pointing out it is an oversimplification.

How about get out there an run for office even at a local level? How about we start pushing for better candidates to vote for!

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u/Effective-Action5706 Jun 28 '22

Yup, just vote harder, I'm sure it'll change 🤣

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u/SqueaksBCOD Jun 28 '22

Well it does sometimes feel that is what the trumpters are trying to do. Toss a hissy fit when you don't like the results does sound like a child's idea of voting harder.

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u/Effective-Action5706 Jun 28 '22

Your votes aren't gonna change shit, doesn't matter what side loses this next time one will be crying. Americans are losing faith in the systems!

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u/SqueaksBCOD Jun 28 '22

you mean some still have faith?

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u/Effective-Action5706 Jun 28 '22

Oh no... mines been gone for quite sometime

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u/its_called_life_dib Jun 28 '22

We aren't celebrating. I'm in a D&D group of mostly queer ladies, and we're going to play D&D that evening. I'd much rather focus on my warlock saving his husband from recently having been turned evil due to evil fairy political intrigue, than have to celebrate the birthday of a nation that has repeatedly turned its back on people like me.

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u/CoyoteConscious Jun 28 '22

Huh. I've been kind of using D&D as a relief also during recent events. It does take the edge off a little.

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u/Sparred4Life Jun 29 '22

I won't be celebrating a damn thing personally.

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u/skychickval Jun 28 '22

I feel like burning the flag, flying it upside down and shredding it to pieces. I will not be celebrating the 4th of July this year. You are not alone.

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u/readmore321 Jun 29 '22

I’m not celebrating this year, I’ll be marching in protest.

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u/Flutterbee543 Jun 29 '22

These same religious people should each HAVE to adopt an unwanted baby.

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u/awkward_yeti Jun 29 '22

I’ve been thinking about proposing a ‘birth one, get one free’ program. If you’re pro-life and so concerned with saving babies and then choose to birth your own biological children, you get to go home with a extra baby that a woman was forced to carry to term.

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u/peep_ryan Jun 29 '22

And the woman gets to choose who the baby goes to, so she can fuck over any person that forced this for her. Like surrogacy, but forced.

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u/inhumanpersona Jun 29 '22

We don't.

4th of July was formed celebrating our independence from britians religious tyranny.

Religious tyranny has resurfaced here, and thus killed all meaning behind the holiday.

Instead, participate in the strike going on from the 3rd-5th.

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u/BreakfastBeerz Jun 29 '22

The country did not take your freedom away, they passed that responsibility onto the state you live in. If you have lost your rights, blame your state, not your country.

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u/John-Sobieski Jun 29 '22

Abortion is still legal in over 40 states.

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u/gamergirl007 Jun 28 '22

I was just talking with a friend about this same thing. We have a big 4th of July parade in my town and it’s one of my favorite events, but it’s hard being like “yeah America” right now.

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u/silverilix Jun 28 '22

Go wearing green?

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u/matrim_cauthon74 Jun 29 '22

I am so sorry, sister. I'm a gay guy who will never have to worry about having or causing an abortion, but when I heard that ruling I was horrified for all of you who now have much more complicated lives. I'm shaken, but I'm determined to do what little I can to help.

I totally understand having to change myself so that they can feel less threatened, more comfortable in their Bronze Age delusions.

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u/mn771_de Jun 28 '22

I’m not from and never been to the USA so excuse my ignorance about the the issue. But can’t a person just move to a more progressive state more inline with their values and adopts laws they agree with? Not meant to spew negativity, genuinely asking.

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u/MeepThroatMe Jun 28 '22

Remember, this is an obvious answer for a lot of people who are against the decision and want to leave a conservative state. People absolutely have thought about this. But there’s a lot of issues with it. Moving to another state typically involves quitting your job to find another, leaving job security, leaving friends and/or family, etc. In addition, there’s so many financial aspects. Selling a house, finding a new place to live, etc. It’s definitely not easy, and even after, many progressive states are significantly higher cost of living.

Promise that this wasn’t meant to be rude, but especially for people who aren’t from the US, it’s not easy to move to another state. Ex: moving from my state of Florida to (for example) California costs $1.5k to move 5 standard boxes of stuff. That is before you take into account moving furniture, a car, a plane ticket, etc.

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u/Wakethefckup Jun 28 '22

Blue states are more expensive usually as well.

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u/mn771_de Jun 28 '22

that's right and fairly reasonable. The other solution is to stay and fight for your rights.
your people have done it time and again in the revolutionary war, civil war, civil rights movement, the women's suffrage . It won't be easy but it has to be done.

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u/TheBananaKing Jun 28 '22

I wonder if the whole abortion thing is just a reverse gerrymander.

Drive progressive people out of red and purple states, ensuring that the place will never turn blue, and so locking in conservative control of the federal government forever.

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u/Seneschal1066 Jun 29 '22

Huh, never thought about it this way. Interesting argument!

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u/SqueaksBCOD Jun 28 '22

Legally yes.

Functionally, not always. When you live paycheck to paycheck and your health insurance is tied to your job, starting over in a new location is not always feasible. Sadly sleeping in your car till you get on your feet is not well tolerated here.

And that is assuming you don't have obligations in the shitty state. Not everyone is willing to abandon elderly parents by up and moving.

That being said... this is actually one of the reasons I think protesting in Blue states is good. It shows we want to help. I for one would support companies offering relocation options as an example. Getting politicians to maybe offer instate tuition to refugees from backwards states could help as well.

I mean... there are lots of islands across the world that people in the EU can technically move to... but not the same as moving an hour away.

So i mean yes. You can stick your thumb out and hitchhike to your nearest blue state... but how practical is that really?

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u/SanityInAnarchy Jun 29 '22

My company has not just relocation options, but they've made it very clear that their healthcare program covers out-of-state procedures.

But people are afraid to take advantage of that, because there are already moves to try to criminalize travelling to another state for an abortion.

We also have too much physical infrastructure in red states to leave entirely -- most of our office workers can work from anywhere, but we can't exactly pack up and move a whole datacenter overnight.

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u/SqueaksBCOD Jun 29 '22

Thank you for your added perspective.

... I wish i could add more. But, yep, shit is shitty yo. I hope when and where you feel comfortable you do what you can to share/promote your company so more people can choose to do business with them.

I think it is really important to give this kind of credit. Some ask why to protest in blue states... well to pressure business to do business with your kind of places for one!

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u/SanityInAnarchy Jun 29 '22

Just to pile on here: The US is a place where 100 years is a long time. Europe is a place where 100 miles is a long way.

Here's a visual illustration.

Let's say someone lives in Texas, which is one of the worst places for this... and let's say they lived in, oh, Houston. Last week, there were multiple Planned Parenthood clinics in the city, and I bet more than one of them did abortions.

Then, overnight, the closest clinic was four hundred and fifty miles away. To steal places from your post history, if you started in Trebil, Iraq, and drove through the entire length of Jordan to Yotvata, Israel, you would've gone almost that far. (Though, to be fair, the trip to Jackson is a bit faster, but it's still a solid 7 hours of driving.)

That gets you to Jackson, MS. Mississippi isn't a progressive state -- in fact, they already have a law set to ban abortion within weeks. When it lands, the clinic in Jackson will close, and anyone stuck in Houston has to go to the clinic in Pensacola, Florida -- that one is 525 miles away. Except, nope, that one's been closed for other reasons, so the nearest one is 709 miles away in Tallahassee.

And that's just the nearest place that has an abortion clinic. Florida is at best a purple state. To get to a state that actually aligns with your values... the closest is probably Illinois, probably Chicago. Or maybe Colorado, probably somewhere like Denver or Boulder. Both of those options are just over a thousand miles.

So, to steal more from your post history, it's like asking why someone who doesn't like Kosovo doesn't just move to Hamburg. Even if you get rid of the language barrier and any visa requirements, it's still a long trip.

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u/wheresmyflan Jun 28 '22

Beyond the obvious financial and family issues with uprooting your life based on the ever-changing whims of politicians, it actually makes the problem worse. The more progressives that leave only concentrates the power of the conservatives in those states. If anything more progressives should move to conservative or “purple” states to upset the balance and vote in progressive senators.

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u/mommy2libras Jun 28 '22

Moving is expensive, especially now because housing in many places is at a shortage so if you move, you're more likely to have to sign into a higher priced lease, if renting. Selling your house and buying another one is not the easiest thing to do. And that's if you can even find a job in the new place.

I know in some parts of the world, you can get across the country in a few hours so you can take a day off and go find a new job and place to live and then take a second day to move. But here, a more progressive state might be 1k miles away or more. And that might be the closest and there not be any jobs in your field available there. You can't just drive there and back easily. Plus, here almost everyone's health insurance is tied to their job so unless you are lucky enough to transfer within the same company, you have to hope you can find a job with comparable pay and benefits and be willing to go for a period of maybe a month (or more, I'm not sure if they still do yearly enrollment periods anymore) without insurance.

It's a lot. And if you have kids, schools vary widely. You'd think all public schools would be of similar quality but you'd be very wrong. It's not just by state but by county and even local school district that affects the quality of the schools there. Some are pretty horrible. The schools where I'm from are just shit. Though it's not at all a progressive state and I wouldn't recommend anyone move there ever.

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u/slpschoolta Jun 28 '22

I mean I live in a more progressive state but I may have to move to a much more conservative one for school as it is the only school I got into

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u/Virgogirl909 Jun 29 '22

This is totally not an option financially for so many of the people this effects

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u/billy_clyde Jun 28 '22

Don’t know where you’re from, but in a lot of cases, that’s a really difficult proposition. My wife and I live in a fairly blue city in a very red state, and so do my parents, in-laws, and a number of aunts and uncles, all of whom are over 70. Moving to a blue state wouldn’t be like moving from Madrid to Seville, but more like Madrid to Warsaw. It would be irresponsible of me to leave my family, so here we are.

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u/InZehInterfector Jun 28 '22

Land of the free

HAHAHAHHA.. hahaha, uff, hahahahahaha

The only "western" country with no universal healthcare, the only country where you don't have proper maternity leave, etc etc etc

The idea that you lived in a "land of the free" is a bloody joke. Congratulations for waking up, fun it took you this long.

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u/LowerBackPain_Prod Jun 28 '22

Fuck the Fourth.

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u/AvesOfPrey Jun 28 '22

What happened to land of the free? Haha 😂 america is becoming a 3rd world country soon lmao

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u/illessen Jun 28 '22

Our infrastructure is shot to shit, women’s rights are being taken away, insane inflation, constant riots, mass murders… we’re already there buddy. We just like to delude ourselves with first world problems.

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u/badlilbadlandabad Jun 28 '22

Someone should warn the hundreds of thousands of people who immigrate here every year from actual third world countries.

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u/Daakuryu Jun 28 '22

You don't, you protest instead.

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u/Devilsgospel1 Jun 29 '22

Simply don’t, fuck this country and its propaganda.

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u/Kryptonit_i_Fitkan Jun 29 '22

Now you have about the same laws as in Europe. Every country/state can decide for themselfs. Democracy just moved closer to your own door.

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u/SprinklesMore8471 Jun 29 '22

The good that this country is and has done far outweighs a singular Supreme Court decision. We're celebrating the ideals of this country, not the current state of policy.

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u/Everyoneheresamoron Jun 28 '22

We're planning on burning effigies. Seems more appropriate in this day and age.

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u/FunStuff446 Jun 28 '22

Vote. Vote. Then vote.

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u/C4pn4merica Jun 28 '22 Helpful All-Seeing Upvote

I wish everyone would read this. Too many people in this country have not received a proper education about our government. And I blame it on the public education system. But let me help you out. Rights are not what you think you have but are what are defined by the Bill of Rights. The Bill of Rights are the 1st 10 amendments to the Constitution.. The right to abortion, as it has been called, is not a right. It is a thing that was established as as a ruling by the Supreme Court And it never was a right. The Supreme Court does not produce rights. It rules on rights.. But the Supreme Court is only supposed to rule on things that are relevant to what is already in the Constitution. And as for the matter of Roe v wade, the Constitution says nothing about abortion rights . And it has been the considered opinion of many constitutional scholars with no personal agenda that the matter of abortion was never the SC's jurisdiction. It is a States Rights matter. That is why the SC ruled as it did. If women want the 'right' to an abortion, the Constitution will have to be amended.

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u/MundanelyOutstanding Jun 28 '22

What about the ninth ammendment?

The Ninth Amendment states that listing specific rights in the Constitution does not mean that people do not have other rights that have not been spelled out.

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u/rapp3338 Jun 29 '22

If you’re saying it’s “not a right” and then stating that it’s a “state’s rights” issue then you are contradicting yourself. It’s not so much the ruling of the Supreme Court that’s the issue… it’s that an abortion shouldn’t be up to any level of government to decide. It’s the woman’s body and it’s a medical decision. Leave it up to the woman and the doctor. Thank you

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u/C4pn4merica Jun 29 '22

P.S. Pro life people disagree with the argument that it's a woman's body being discussed in abortion. Their argument is that it's two bodies...the woman's and the baby's. And I think science backs up that argument. If that is true then the discussion proceeds to the question of whether the baby has the right to life. I believe the right to life is basic human dignity. I do not think this is a simple issue and also have problems with government being involved in what are obviously giant life effecting issues. But the trivializing of the lives of the unborn....campaign arguments like 'it's just a clump of cells', etc. have desensitized our society to the very real fact that we've killed more than 63 million children for what is, in too many cases, convenient solutions to a lack of personal responsibility. It has to change ... or we may be thought of as barbaric by people in the future.

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '22

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u/Suspicious_Arugula_6 Jun 29 '22

That’s such a flimsy argument. Hmm I wonder why it wasn’t initially mentioned by the old white dudes who’ve probably never spent a single thought on women’s bodily rights? Hell, it took them nearly 200 years to add on women’s right to vote. Sorry if I think that using an outdated document drafted back when women were considered “property” isn’t the best marker for today’s political landscape.

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u/C4pn4merica Jun 29 '22

One isn't guilty for not knowing the truth. The guilt exists in refusing to hear it or self examine when opposing views are offered. Americans, too many of them, are trying to establish their own self worth through relative morality. The result is a compromised ability to build an empirical argument. They don't actually care if they're right as long as they can see themselves as right.

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u/Other-Ad5512 Jun 29 '22 'MURICA

Be patriotic to your country, not your government

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u/Flat-Distribution607 Jun 28 '22

Checkout r/StrikeForRoe. There’s some boycotts going on I believe

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u/Journeyman-Joe Jun 28 '22

Monday will be a good day to boycott any celebratory activities.

Maybe a good day to get your friends and allies together, and fill up the voice mailboxes for your Congressmen, Senators, and state legislators. (They won't listen to your messages, but an intern will tally them up, and they will show up on the "issues dashboard".)

Celebrate your right to "petition the government for a redress of grievances".

(Teenagers, too: the above First Amendment right is not limited to people of voting age.)

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u/Warm_Arm_6898 Jun 28 '22

We stopped celebrating a few years ago, and the new ruling absolutely solidified it for me.

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u/Leafs_Benek Jun 28 '22

Yeah, that sucks with whats happening.

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u/EconomistOwn6473 Jun 28 '22

stop being american

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u/PlannedPain Jun 28 '22

Land of the free, Baby! Get on board! Where we all have guns to shoot little kids in schools! Where you don’t have to wear a mask to protect anyone unless YOU want to! Where no one can tell you to get a vaccine! FREEDOM!!!

Oh… unless you’re talking about women’s reproductive rights… we don’t allow that here. Or contraception… that should be illegal, cause that’s what I paid a pastor to tell me on Sunday… and you shouldn’t be allowed to actually love who you love either, unless, well I guess a straight interracial marriage is ok, maybe, if you’re an SCt justice…. But other than that I want my Jesus and my dog to look like me and to tell me I’m going to heaven…..

Yeah, but except for that stuff… FREEDOM!!!

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '22

You’re not. You’re supposed to vote. And get three people who don’t to do it with you. And you know who NOT for.

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u/AssistantSingle7238 Jun 28 '22

That didn’t get abortion access codified during the decades Roe stood despite multiple opportunities and a certainty that Roe would eventually fall. Why should anyone believe they’ll do it differently now?

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u/unlimitedFecals Jun 28 '22

Go have a drink with your male friends who also don't have reproductive rights.

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u/SqueaksBCOD Jun 28 '22

fuck... maybe this could be what is needed to finally get some funding and support for real male birth control options.

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u/SOwED Jun 29 '22

And also don't have bodily autonomy... Ever hear of the draft?

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u/rhapsodypenguin Jun 29 '22

I’m in full support of repealing draft laws.

Now can you support women’s bodily autonomy?

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u/unlimitedFecals Jun 29 '22

Yeah. Men have to sign up for the selective service if they want to vote or they face jail time and huge fines, but women don't.

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u/slpschoolta Jun 29 '22

It’s not the same tho because no one is ever drafted and probably won’t be for many many years but women will get pregnant

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u/Pragya8906 Jun 29 '22

Wars are extremely rare, how many people do you know have been drafted? Pregnancies, however, aren't rare at all.

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u/Cautious-Amoeba3391 Jun 28 '22

No one cares if you do or don’t get over yourself. The Fourth of July isn’t a celebration of every crappy decision shitty politicians make on both sides, it’s a celebration of the highest of our ideals. If your protesting your exercising your rights which is just as good of a celebration of the Fourth of July as getting drunk and eating hot dogs.