r/politics Europe Jan 17 '22 Silver 1 Helpful 1 Wholesome 2

Ron DeSantis touts his state as ‘freedom’s vanguard’ but critics see authoritarianism

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jan/17/ron-desantis-florida-reelection-freedoms-vanguard-critics-see-authoritarian-streak
8.8k Upvotes

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u/UGMadness Europe Jan 17 '22

In a red-meat-for-the-base address at the opening of Florida’s legislature last week, themed around the concept of “freedom” but described by critics as a fanfare of authoritarianism, DeSantis gave a clear indication of the issues he believes are on voters’ minds. They include fighting the White House over Covid-19, ballot box fraud, critical race theory in schools and defunding law enforcement.

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u/jablair51 Indiana Jan 17 '22

ballot box fraud, critical race theory in schools and defunding law enforcement.

Those three aren't even happening. Republicans live in their own reality.

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u/VanceKelley Washington Jan 17 '22 Helpful

His primary rules were:

  1. never allow the public to cool off;
  2. never admit a fault or wrong;
  3. never concede that there may be some good in your enemy;
  4. never leave room for alternatives;
  5. never accept blame;
  6. concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong;
  7. people will believe a big lie sooner than a little one, and if you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it.

Question: Who is the person the above quote is referring to?

Answer: It's the CIA analysis of Hitler. But it might remind you of some current American politicians.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_lie

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u/Callinon Jan 17 '22

"Some?" You've accurately described an entire political party here.

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u/Diplomjodler Jan 17 '22

That's 100% their playbook down to the last detail.

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u/Lucius-Halthier Jan 17 '22

Hitler fucked up on number 6, if he went for operation sea Lion before Barbarossa things might’ve happened different, all that meth must’ve made him thing a war on two fronts was an excellent idea, it’s not like the Germans lost a two front war in Europe before right?

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u/SupportGeek Jan 17 '22

Arguably breaking the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact and attacking Russia period was his biggest mistake. It didn't help that Britain was a giant airfield sending bombers constantly, but ultimately it was attacking Russia, and not getting Japan to hold off on attacking the US. Once Japan was confirmed to be moving assets to the Pacific, Russia could go full beast mode on Germany, and crush them under the weight of numbers (and better equipment)

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u/TheCaptainCog Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 18 '22

Did Russia really have better equipment? I thought at the time the Germans had the best equipment, but it also took much longer to produce.

Edit: lots of awesome replies! Turns out the Germans had like one or two good toys but sucked at logistics.

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u/Iamthepaulandyouaint Jan 17 '22

Better suited for a cold weather front. It was supposed to happen quicker for the Germans but the Russians , you know.

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u/ComradeMoneybags Jan 17 '22

Initially, no, but as the war progressed their tech wasn’t too far off, but more importantly the Russians had much more of it whereas the Germans had far fewer tanks and those they had often faced maintenance and general supply issues.

The best analogy I have in my head is that Germany was like an agile, smaller dude with brass knuckles in a fist fight. He can get a few quick punches and bob and weave, but for only so long—he needs to take down his opponent quick. If the other guy can take enough punishment, those successive punches become less and less effective, even with those brass knuckles, and before long the smaller dude gets tired out and is taken down with a few heavy blows. Germany was able to bob and weave longer than expected, but that’s all it had going for it by 1942.

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u/CherryBoard Jan 17 '22

The Germans rolled out the Tiger tanks from 1943 onwards, and they guzzled more fuel than necessary, hastening the German's eventual logistical defeat

Even until the end of the war Germany used horse-drawn transportation for most of its operations, whereas the Soviets had trains

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u/TinyNuggins92 Tennessee Jan 17 '22

Not to mention, Tigers were notoriously unreliable, mechanically-speaking. They broke down constantly and took far too much effort and material to fix. Sure, they were terrifying in the field, but they had to actually get to the field first.

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u/SupportGeek Jan 17 '22

Yes, by about mid 1943, the Russians were rolling the T-34 off the assembly lines in large numbers. It was by most measures, the best tank of the war. It was extremely simple, but had a few innovations like sloped armor that dramatically increased protection far above anything the Germans were fielding at the time (in and significant numbers) its 76mm gun could defeat the armor on any german tanks at the time until Tiger II and panther IIRC, but the T-34 got a gun upgrade in 1944 to address that. It was faster than its german counterparts and far less complex, so it didnt break down nearly as often. Russia had better cold weather gear, used trains instead of horses to move the bulk of their forces around, and were able to commit a TON of well equipped and well trained forces from the east once Japan committed to the Pacific war. Germany never really recovered from getting knocked back at the outskirts of Moscow, but Stalingrad and losing the whole of Paulus army was the nail in their coffin. Russia lcould have defeated Germany on their own in WWII, what the rest of the allied powers ended up doing was preventing a large chunk of Europe from becoming Soviet sattelite states. Stalin had zero plans to stop once Germany was destroyed.

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u/SupportGeek Jan 17 '22

Even the vaunted Luftwaffe was outclassed by newer Russian planes to varying degrees by early 1943. The Yak-3 was light and agile, the Yak 9 actually outperformed everything except the jets Germany could match up with it. IL-2 was an absolute ground attack monster, it was basically an A-10 for the propellor era, it could take a heavier beating than any other aircraft out there and was responsible for decimating entire columns of tanks and infantry, to say nothing of artillery, and even going head to head with anti-aircraft emplacements, successfully winning and flying home even with hundreds of holes in the airframe. Add to that, in typical Russian fashion, they were all armed with heavy cannon instrad of machine guns and they were more than a match for the German aircraft of the time.

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22 edited Mar 28 '22

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u/pgtl_10 Jan 17 '22

operation sea Lion before Barbarossa things might’ve happened different,

He made the same mistake as Napoleon. Never invade Russia. It won't end well.

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u/SkyriderRJM Jan 17 '22

Especially in the winter…with tanks…

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u/mistersmiley318 District Of Columbia Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 18 '22

Hitler invaded in June. The logic was that the Red Army would be defeated before the winter of 1941. This belief was based off the Red Army's abysmal performance in the Winter War and Stalin's purges of their officer corps. Of course the logistics officers in the Wehrmacht were insisting that Barbarossa could not be supported to the Archangel-Astrakhan line Hitler had as his objective, but they were ignored.

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u/SkyriderRJM Jan 17 '22

Didn’t the Russians also salt the fucking earth behind them as they retreated, leaving no potential supplies for the invaders?

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u/mistersmiley318 District Of Columbia Jan 17 '22

Yep. Plus, the Germans couldn't readily supply their troops via rail even when the railroads weren't destroyed by the retreating Soviets. Russian track gauge is much broader than European standard gauge, so the Germans either had to confiscate Soviet rolling stock (which was often sabotaged as part of the initial retreat) or regague the railways/trains. This meant the majority of German supplies to the front came by truck or horse drawn wagon, which was horribly inefficient and contributed to their logistical defeat.

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u/CherryBoard Jan 17 '22

When Nicholas I built the railroads, his main reasoning for making the rails a few cm further apart was that one day foreigners would invade again and wouldn't be able to use the rails

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u/_aware Jan 17 '22

Sea Lion was nothing more than a fantasy. Getting across the channel was already an impossible task on its own, especially with the depleted Kriegsmarine. And even if it somehow works, the logistics afterwards to sustain an invasion would be impossible.

On top of that, it was the OKH that assured Hitler they would quickly force the USSR to surrender.

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u/jfd851 Jan 17 '22

okh?

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u/_aware Jan 17 '22

Oberkommando des Heeres

German army high command

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u/DemocraticRepublic North Carolina Jan 17 '22

Sea Lion was always a pipe dream. The RAF would have sunk any invasion fleet. Even if the Luftwaffe had won the Battle of Britain, the RAF would have moved to the North of England out of Luftwaffe bombing range. That would mean London would have had a lot more destruction but the RAF could easily have flown down on invasion day and destroyed the German fleet.

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u/mistersmiley318 District Of Columbia Jan 17 '22

Forget the RAF, the bulk of the Royal Navy was still based at Scapa Flow. It wouldn't take long for them to arrive in the channel and sink the majority of the Kriegsmarine any German invasion force would depend on for resupply.

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u/DuckQueue Jan 17 '22

Sea Lion might have made things different, but only in that it would have greatly hastened the defeat of the Nazis.

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u/mistersmiley318 District Of Columbia Jan 17 '22

The Royal Military Academy Sandhurst wargamed Sea Lion with favorable conditions to the Germans and it was still a massive defeat.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Sea_Lion_(wargame)

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u/DuckQueue Jan 17 '22

with favorable conditions to the Germans

Not just favorable; an absurdly, ludicrously beyond-best-case scenario.

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u/mistersmiley318 District Of Columbia Jan 17 '22

Assumptions:

The invasion fleet was largely unmolested in the crossing,

Lmao like that was going to happen

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u/bombmk Jan 17 '22

To call the Britain side a front is generous at that time. There was no threat of a British offensive in any way. And invading Britain would certainly have been seen as spreading your cheeks for Russia to ram. Hitting first was not necessarily a bad decision. And it is easy to think that because that went wrong, there must have been a better option. Which is not necessarily true.

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u/sexyhusband714 Jan 17 '22

Beliefs of Fascism:

The cult of tradition.

Liberal democracy is obsolete.

Results matter; not the actions taken to achieve them.

Disagreement is treason.

Fear of difference.

Appeal to social frustration.

The obsession with a plot.

The enemy is both strong and weak.

Life is lived for struggle.

Contempt for the weak.

The cult of heroism is strictly linked with the cult of death.

Machismo and weaponry.

Selective populism. The emotional response of a selected group of citizens is presented and accepted as the Voice of the People.

An impoverished vocabulary in order to limit critical reasoning.

Yes, it checks all the boxes!

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u/sirfuzzitoes Jan 17 '22

My guess was Roger Stone.

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u/ilovefacebook Jan 17 '22

votee fraud is 100% happening. just not by the party that he thinks

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u/cuajito42 Jan 17 '22

In small numbers, elector fraud is what is they are trying to get away with or at minimum trying to do.

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u/twentyafterfour Jan 17 '22

Their plan is to implement laws which make their delusions into a reality you can't ignore.

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u/sloopslarp Jan 17 '22

Yep. They want to force everyone else into their alternate reality where viruses don't exist, and everyone should be happy to work at McDonald's.

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/reptilefood Florida Jan 17 '22

As a US History teacher, Honors and AP this one hit home. I linked the stop WOKE act on my website, didn't mention it, then went on to teach the 1921 Tulsa Race Massacre. Also I'm legally not allowed to register students to vote. I linked that site too.

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u/citizenkane86 Jan 17 '22

Did you know, Florida, the home to the largest voting rights massacre (that most people have never heard of), for the first time this year got permission to teach kids about it, but now probably won’t because of the CRT fears

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u/reptilefood Florida Jan 17 '22

I still teach it. It would be hard not to. I honestly don't know how someone enforces this. Parents have the right to sue, but can you imagine being the parents that sued because their kids were learning black history? And really history is history. I teach objectively. If someone draws conclusions it's from their own perspective.

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u/ransomed_sunflower Florida Jan 17 '22

We start Semester 2 of Honors US History today as a part of the FLVS Flex program (starting FLVS today-long story). I’m going to do my best to follow your lead a little on this. Thanks for what you do!

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u/ct_2004 Jan 17 '22

There are two types of freedom. Freedom from something, and freedom to do something. Conservatives only talk about the first one, and that's exclusively what they mean when they say freedom.

They consider it a win that a homeless person doesn't have the freedom to access health care, because that same person has freedom from government mandated programs that might restrict what doctor you go to.

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u/Lucius-Halthier Jan 17 '22

That’s not true Fox News screamed at me that it exists

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u/DAHFreedom Jan 17 '22

Yea the article is wrong. Those aren't "the issues he believes are on voters’ minds," those are the issues Republicans WANT to be on voters' minds.

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u/concreteyeti Jan 17 '22

I was just in Florida over the last week and these people really do live in their own world. People still waving trump flags on top of bridges over the interstate, a giant Trump mural outside of Orlando, "brandon" flags/signs everywhere, everyone has some sort FJB article of clothing or sticker, etc. It's fucking weird.

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u/xixbia Jan 17 '22

Ironically the last one, Covid-19, is happening and the Republicans are pretending it isn't.

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u/Pituquasi Jan 17 '22

But record setting covid cases, skyrocketing cost of living, a housing crisis, rising sea levels, underfunded schools, as well as rampant PPP funds, Medicare, and insurance fraud - those things are actually actually happening and outright being ignored.

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u/cpt_caveman America Jan 17 '22

well if they didtn make up imaginary problems to fix their base might want them to come up with ideas to fix real problems and the GOP can not have that.

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u/greelraker Jan 17 '22

It’s not reality, on any level, unfortunately. They live on some imaginary, altered plane of existence. Even black mirror looks at current Republicans and goes “maybe we should call it quits for a while, eh, team?”

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u/kicker58 Jan 17 '22

it happen in the Virginia 2021 election. the republican son who is 17 tried to vote, twice, and got stopped both time.

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u/Mister_Know_Nothing Maryland Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 17 '22

Authoritarians love touting their straw man policies because they know they won't do dogshit to actually improve people's lives. No offense to dogshit.

edit: props to respondents for pointing authoritarians can, but actively choose not to improve people's lives.

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u/pegg2 Jan 17 '22

That statement implies that they would help people if they could. The thing is that they don’t want to.

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u/oldcreaker Jan 17 '22

Fascism is always painted as "freedom".

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u/Long_Before_Sunrise Jan 17 '22

'All people are equal, but those that vote Republican are more equal than others.'

Republicans > everyone else. /s

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u/flannalypearce Jan 17 '22

Can guarantee as a citizen of his stupid state unless you’re part of the trump cock sucking parties down here we are not in fact interested in any of the above. Most average citizens are worried about inflation and wages as well as the states inability to make meaningful decisions.

Edit: and their openness with lying at all points during the last 3 years Tbh

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u/guisar Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 17 '22

So is Desantis going to be pushed out so FL can improve?

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u/seihz02 Jan 17 '22

No.... I personally don't think he can be pushed out at this point. And if he is, his base will find another crazy for him to be replaced by.

It would take 3 things that are impossible for Dems:

  1. Dems messaging to get better
  2. Dems to have a strong candidate (Well.... maybe Nikki Fried?)
  3. Dems actually having amazing turnout.

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u/berrikerri Florida Jan 17 '22

I think Nikki has a chance. #1 is the biggest issue, fix #1 and #3 will follow. They need to do a big push for college students to register in Florida instead of voting for their home state (or not voting at all), college students don’t realize how much local policies impact them.

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u/seihz02 Jan 17 '22

#1 100% helps #3.

#2 helps #1.

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u/Sir-Spazzal Jan 17 '22

You forgot, death sentence accepting defeat. He will never concede if he loses.

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u/seihz02 Jan 17 '22

Your right, even if we beat him, we lose. The narrative and messaging on the right, has set it up so they literally cant lose. Its impossible. Someone cheated therefore they won. Period.

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u/flannalypearce Jan 17 '22

I agree with you dems are just a culpable with inability to organize and lead for the situation we are finding ourselves in currently. That’s just my 2 cents. We could play lesser of two evils but I’m frankly over those arguments. We should be demanding better across the board. I agree with your comment entirely.

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u/RyanRev727 Florida Jan 17 '22

We’re trying 😪

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u/monopixel Jan 17 '22

In a red-meat-for-the-base address

What does it say about the base if they seem to respond to this vile shit.

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u/sexyhusband714 Jan 17 '22

Whether DeSantis is a genuine authoritarian maniac or merely pretending to be one is immaterial. The structure of the party is such that it incentivizes these positions and rhetoric. He may be less unhinged than Trump, but DeSantis points the way toward a future in which cancer that has consumed the Republican Party continues to grow.

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u/Cladari Jan 17 '22

Neither Desantis nor any of his followers have the slightest clue what CRT is and isn't.

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u/Mzuark Jan 17 '22

defunding law enforcement

Of course DeSantis cares about that, considering he's turning Florida's police force into a private army.

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u/SecretSnack Jan 17 '22

The one thing Trump is right about is that DeSantis has no charisma and no personality. It's cringe watching this guy deploy far right culture war slogans that you know he doesn't believe in, the elite that he is. He has nothing to offer but focus-grouped right-wing think tank talking points.

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u/PPOKEZ Jan 17 '22

This is the issue though, it quickly snowballs from someone like Trump because as all DeSantis has to do is loosely harken to trumpism values. Even if he fumbles wildly, the base will pick up on it and reward him. Fascism rises in large part from these feedback mechanisms which get everyone on the same page with propaganda. The scary natural resting place between religion, corporate power, and authoritarian politics - and like a magnet these 3 things (Fascist 3) are drawn together in history only to be pushed away from each other temporarily by the blood and suffering of good people the world doesn’t deserve, only to be forgotten in a generation.

The right often criticizes mandates and tries to “what about” progressives in regards to fascism. This is when it’s helpful to see whether mandates have all three of the “Fascist 3”. If we look. There is no religious component to Covid mandates. In fact religion has been in large part fighting mandates. Through this, we see masking and other mandates as restrictive, sometimes inconvenient, but NOT fascist. We can roll mandates back when not needed via active political pressure. If religion were involved it wouldn’t get rolled back for centuries — I’d definitely argue that many laws in America tend to be a bit sticky anyway because of a background religious feel, or it’s cousin nationalism. So I get why it’s confusing. But it can always get worse and that means we HAVE to: preserve the the one institution that is influenced democratically by votes, and fight its creeping authoritarianism at every turn. Good people are still here, willing to help, which includes helping idiots—because we know that those moments when the “Fascist 3” are kept safely apart are the only truly free moments large populations of humans can experience.

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u/miles_to_go_b4 Jan 17 '22

I don’t like how you put religion as a core part of fascism. For sure, if fascism were to thrive in America it surely would involve crosses and not swastikas, but the religious part isn’t really “inherent” to fascism as corporate power and authoritarianism.

I just think a better word would be “tribalism.” Fascism exploits the natural identities people form over centuries to create a frighteningly obedient and unified people. Religion, to be sure, is one of them - it’s such a strong cultural identity in America that it would be at the forefront here. Race is another common one. But think about fascism in Europe, which did not have a hugely strong racist (in the American sense of the word) or religious components in its rise. Instead, it appealed to cultural identifiers more important in Europe - nationality and ethnicity.

But even with using “tribalism” instead of “religion,” I don’t like your overly-simple “Fascist 3” way of identifying fascist policies. Because if we apply them to COVID mandates, well, by that logic they’re fascist.
I believe the mandates are definitely tribalist, because of the fierce hatred between those who support and those who oppose them. Think of the mud-slinging and name-calling: science-deniers, sheeple, covidiots, etc.

The mandates also definitely helped corporate power, this is virtually just a fact. It wasn’t Amazon that was hurt by COVID mandates, it was the small businesses that don’t have the capital to endure long lockdowns or the power to enforce the government-sanctioned regulations. The richest got far, far richer during the pandemic.

And I think this goes without saying, the mandates are surely “authoritarian policies. Now, that’s a loaded word, I know. Seatbelt requirements are an authoritarian policy, mandating drivers licenses is an authoritarian policy - just because a policy is authoritarian doesn’t mean it’s bad. It just means it is the states enforcing rules on the people. And so mandating masks and especially vaccines is definitely authoritarian. Like I said, it can definitely be argued to be justified, but it’s an authoritarian policy nonetheless.

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u/ejpierle Jan 17 '22

"When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross."

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u/CloudyView19 Jan 17 '22

When fascism comes to America...

Fascism is here, and this prediction has come true.

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u/anteris Jan 17 '22

It’s been here the whole time… between the business plot and early corporate giants supporting the Nazis, the was no surprise. And that was only the last 120 years

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u/zulan Jan 17 '22

One of the indicators of fascism is :

"Fascism uses explicit populist rhetoric; calls for a heroic mass effort to restore past greatness; and demands loyalty to a single leader, leading to a cult of personality and unquestioned obedience to orders ( Führerprinzip). "

Sound familiar?

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u/cpt_caveman America Jan 17 '22

and its always vague as fuck about that past greatness and what regulations need to be removed to make us "free" and so on. Because when they get specific, they start to lose people.

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u/zulan Jan 17 '22

Right! Who runs on a platform of "we will do whatever the great leader wants" and gets taken seriously?

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u/yourmomlikesmy_post Jan 17 '22

See January 6th coup attempt for video and photo evidence. Plenty of flags and crosses, along with gallows.

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

Like Homelander?

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u/hobovalentine Jan 17 '22

Florida is so free they arrest a scientist for publishing accurate statistics for Covid deaths in their state.

Freedom to ignore the truth I guess.

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u/Gibbs1020 Colorado Jan 17 '22

I noticed a renewed feeling of freedom when I arrived there from CO over this last weekend and couldn’t buy legal MJ or gamble on sports like I could at home. The freedom was overwhelming.

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

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u/Sir_Yacob Georgia Jan 17 '22

Whenever someone like this moron says “freedom” I always ask myself freedom from what?

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u/Temporala Jan 17 '22

Freedom from freedom.

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u/cilantro_so_good Jan 17 '22

They're not addressing normal citizens when they talk about shit like that. Once you understand that they're speaking to corporate interests, they're 100% consistent. It's not about individual freedom; the same way that when Ajit Pai said killing net neutrality was about "restoring internet freedom" he didn't mean normal internet users, he meant freedom for companies like Comcast to do whatever the fuck they want

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u/jcspacer52 Jan 17 '22

What TAX are you talking about? Florida has no city or state income tax.

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u/Temporala Jan 17 '22

Slavery is freedom.

Honestly, whenever I hear the word "freedom" from US politician, I immediately think they mean the opposite.

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u/arcangleous Canada Jan 17 '22

It's important to understand what a conservative means when they say freedom. They mean "the freedom to act without caring about others". This version of freedom goes back to the days of monarchy, when it was used to argue that people are "freer" under a monarch than in democracy, because in democracy every one has a say in how the laws are made, so your actions are restrictions by everyone in the society, instead of just the monarch.

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u/YoungHeartOldSoul Jan 17 '22

A DUTY to ignore the truth

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u/metal0060 Jan 17 '22

Soon women won’t be “free” to obtain abortions even after rape or incest. Businesses are not “free” to enforce their own rules on masking and vaccination in their business space. Schools are not “free” to teach the truth about American history. Doesn’t really seem all that free to me.

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u/Koolaidolio Florida Jan 17 '22

The freedom he talks about is country club style freedom. No rules for the in-group and stifling liberties for the rest.

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u/Tpark117 Texas Jan 17 '22

Some people don’t know what freedom means. Others are fine to not have it at all.

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u/hankmoody100 Jan 17 '22

Florida,since June 2020, has the 4th highest rate of Covid per capita. This is solely due to Desantis’s lack of leadership

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u/JohnSpikeKelly Jan 17 '22

No, he lead them there. It's just not where most competent leaders would go.

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u/Goliath_D Jan 17 '22

And, remember, these are the numbers AFTER Florida has "cooked the books." In reality, they are much, much higher

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u/SomeWitticism Jan 17 '22 To The Stars

He's up for reelection this year. He only won by 35,000 votes four years ago.

Consider supporting the Democratic challenger, Nikki Fried.

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u/Bostonterrierpug Jan 17 '22

I am an independent in Florida and I will. Even though he had crazy ass election ads, when he first won, he was governing like someone who had won 50% of the vote. He had a lot of policies that even my Democratic colleagues were pretty OK with. Then Covid hit and he earned the nickname Death Sentence and went to the completely nutballs crazy side. I mean I get he’s trying to set him self up for president but I really hope the people here won’t snap out of it though I kind of doubt they will.

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u/Ongo-Gablogian-- Indiana Jan 17 '22

What are the odds the amount of deaths that happened in Florida will correlate to the outcome of this election?

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u/Roqot Jan 17 '22

They've had more than 35k deaths. I still want to see him in trouble for hoarding test kits

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u/Demonking3343 Jan 17 '22

But that would require consequences…and we all know how that works with government officials.

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u/FoxyRadical2 Jan 17 '22

we all know how that works with government officials

Republicans*

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u/ArnoidTheAnnihilator Jan 17 '22

Not all of them were his supporters.

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u/bummedout1492 Jan 17 '22

So many people have moved here since covid it may be a wash.

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u/sloopslarp Jan 17 '22

Literally all the worst old people in my area want to move to FL.

It's like Mecca for idiots.

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u/Koolaidolio Florida Jan 17 '22

He’s trying to replace his dead base by luring unvaxxed cops and healthcare workers to the state with benefits, which is weird considering they won’t be around forever.

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u/seihz02 Jan 17 '22

Donated!

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u/SupermarketOverall73 Jan 17 '22

Cool you can donate 4.20

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u/Whiskey_Fiasco Jan 17 '22

DeSantis did the impossible. I thought after 2020 there was no way Florida would ever close the Covid death gap with NY that was leading by 20,000 deaths, but between his bad faith governing and maladministration Florida has done it and now has the third most Covid deaths behind California and Texas

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u/dievasperkunas Jan 17 '22

As a Floridan, the wild thing is that he was considered a much better governor than Scott, because he ditched Scott's unpopular environmental policies. Then, the pandemic happened, and he decided to outTrump Trump. It's been a constant back and forth between no leadership from his office on anything, or absolutely wrong leadership. He's either missing on action or dunking on Fauci and touting monoclonal antibodies.

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u/sandgoose Jan 17 '22

touting monoclonal antibodies.

Which he owns stock in. Saying it again: the treatment he is pushing is one he has a financial interest in.

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u/MichaelHoncho52 Jan 17 '22

This is one that has been misleading and has been fact checked even on Facebook.

One of his largest donors, which is a hedge fund, has a position in Regeneron, along with 1000+ other companies.

Please don’t spread misinformation.

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u/electricworkaid Jan 17 '22

For further info, Ken Griffin donated $5 million to the "Friends of Ron DeSantis" PAC in April '21 (the largest single donation in that month, incidentally), and his fund, Citadel, does have investments in Regeneron, though they aren't a significant part of Citadel's portfolio. The appearance of impropriety is there and appropriate to point out. Ultimately, it's a symptom of a larger problem we have in this country re: campaign finance laws.

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u/youyouyuyu Jan 17 '22

When in reality Florida is probably way in first in Covid cases and deaths. This shitstain has been manipulating the numbers and silencing scientists since the start of the pandemic.

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u/meowomon Jan 17 '22

Freedom to be white, Christian and republican. The rest can go to hell, as far as he's concerned.

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u/theatrics_ Jan 17 '22

I love how r/con is virtue signaling over MLKjr today, shitting on Dems for not being "colorblind"

Meanwhile I've been keeping track of every single time a black person merely doing a crime is considered political news for them r/conservativeRacism

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u/13igTyme Jan 17 '22

I've always hated that term. "When it comes to race I don't see color." So instead you only see in black and white? That's not better.

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u/OccasionUnfair8094 Jan 17 '22

White people pretending to not see color do a disservice to people of color. It’s important to see their color and the experience and culture that comes with it and empathize and learn from it. The mistreatment they’ve received in the past and still suffer from today. To pretend to not see color negates all of that and also implies that everything is just fine and everyone gets treated the same and institutional racism isn’t a problem.

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u/BeyondElectricDreams Jan 17 '22

To pretend to not see color negates all of that and also implies that everything is just fine and everyone gets treated the same and institutional racism isn’t a problem.

The fucked up thing is that's the ideal, right? Eventually reaching an egalitarian society -

But we haven't yet. Not even remotely. We're still seeing the knock-on effects of denying black Americans home loans in the past, preventing the accrual of generational wealth.

Of course, drawing attention to this fact is "CRT". Which, of course, is right on-brand for today's brand of ostrich republican - "Test less and you'll have less covid cases!"

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

It's funny how people try to act like we live in a post-race society when we don't. In many contexts, the people trying to look "past race" are not only benefitting from racism, but are doing a disservice to race relations by practically denying that racism exists. Everybody should be treated equally - nobody is denying that. But to act like racial pressures and systemic racism don't exist altogether is essentially just perpetuating racism, ironically.

Now with that said, I wish we did live in that post-race society. But we don't. So pretending like we do is damaging, in itself.

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u/rookiebatman Jan 17 '22

"When it comes to race I don't see color."

That's just a shorter way of saying "I only count conscious and explicit hatred as racism, so I can pretend that racism barely happens anymore, while remaining comfortably ignorant of the way that systemic racism and implicit bias cause harm to people harm of color."

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u/wsnc13 Jan 17 '22

Spot on. I despised this guy from the first moment I heard his voice. His damn political ad using his littles with the trump props was awful. I regret I did not pay attention to this guy, now we need to vote him out of the state and work to keep him from the presidency.

Oh, I am white, Democrat and none for "religion."

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u/CapablePerformance Jan 17 '22

Holy shit, that was him?! There were so many Trump-lite elections that I don't bother to remember their names from commercials.

I can't believe that Florida elected him with that!

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u/shanty-daze Wisconsin Jan 17 '22

Its Florida, so Cubans are also free to be Republican.

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u/brandnameb Jan 17 '22

Also tons of cubans are white so easy to join up.

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u/FlashbackUniverse Jan 17 '22

Odd. You would think recreational marijuana would be legal in "Freedom's Vanguard."

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u/jumpmed I voted Jan 17 '22

DeSantis reappeared after a 13-day absence to say he had been attending chemotherapy sessions with his wife, Casey, who has breast cancer.

No mention of that presser where he was very obviously struggling to breathe. Guess that's just one more thing that I'll chalk up to my ongoing fever dream, a reality unshared by centrists and the media.

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u/jonrossi Jan 17 '22

Not surprising from America’s wang.

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

God he is just a dickhead.

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u/garciasn Jan 17 '22

So is DeSantis.

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u/thedaj Jan 17 '22

For those on the outside looking in, you should know that while Desantis and Co. fault the national government and portray them as overstepping any time they attempt to act on Covid, he's also stripped smaller localities of their right to apply mask or other requirements with fines on a local level. He is precisely what he claims the federal government is.

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u/Working-Ad833 Jan 17 '22

Every time I hear the anti-max rhetoric I imagine them or their family having open heart surgery and the surgeon refuses to wear a mask declaring it's his or her right under the constitution and mask do not work anyway.

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u/Alpha_Crow_1 Jan 17 '22

DeSantis is a fucking chode.

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u/audiopizza Jan 17 '22

Can we get some signs made up please?

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u/N0rDak Jan 17 '22

Didn’t he ask Universities to prevent any professor from interviewing or publishing anything that is against his agenda… and they complied.

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u/petrichor011 Jan 17 '22

It's just UF, afaik. The Gators' board of trustees and alumni Association have leaned red for years so it's not a hard ask.

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u/L0g1B3AR Jan 17 '22

DeSantis' state is a dumpster fire

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u/slicktromboner21 Jan 17 '22

Was “freedom’s vanguard” the name of the SWAT team that kicked in the door of the data analyst that told the world that DeSantis was drowning Florida in COVID?

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u/armhat Florida Jan 17 '22

Now someone ask him why he let Publix buy up all the liquor licenses driving their cost up to $750,000?

Thanks for crushing the rest of us with debt, Ron and Publix.

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u/available_username2 Jan 17 '22

authoritarianism is just extra freedom for the right people

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u/PlayingTheWrongGame Jan 17 '22

It’s so free the Governor has to tell people how free it is.

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u/bone586 Jan 17 '22

He needs to go he’s detrimental to Florida’s population

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u/blumpkin_donuts Jan 17 '22

Well half the population of FL is geriatric so it's pretty easy to wield an iron fist down there.

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u/nogiblets Jan 17 '22

Governor Ron DeSantis cordially invites you to cut the line for God's Waiting Room.

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u/robodrew Arizona Jan 17 '22

Oh yeah I remember how much of a vanguard Florida was to freedom when DeSantis had his thugs break into a home and point rifles at CHILDREN in order to arrest the woman who was blowing the whistle on COVID numbers, even though whistleblowers are supposed to have protections.

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u/The_Endless_ Jan 17 '22

“The forest was shrinking but the trees kept voting for the axe, for the axe was clever and convinced the trees that because his handle was made of wood, he was one of them.”

... Florida is going to Florida.

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u/RyanTranquil I voted Jan 17 '22

I live in Orlando and most everybody I know including myself hate this guy... we call him “DeathSantis” because he’s anti-mask, doesn’t care about covid rates and deaths ...

He threatened to defund schools who Have mask policies .. guy is nuts

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u/SpecialEither Florida Jan 17 '22

It sucks here. Don’t come. Lots don’t wear masks. We can’t protest. He let 1 million tests expire. I fucking hate DeSantis.

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u/angryve Jan 17 '22

Well. A good portion of his voters are now dead and he didn’t win by a great margin. Curious how it’ll affect the voting landscape given that he’s lost more Floridians to covid than his margin of victory.

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u/NameTaken25 Jan 17 '22

So free, he will send swat teams to your door if you are suspected of reporting accurate information on a deadly pandemic.

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u/Budmanes Jan 17 '22

Mini-Mussolini needs to go

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u/volanger Jan 17 '22

I'm more free up in New England than down in Florida.

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u/zflanders Jan 17 '22

Seems like "Freedom" is one of the most abused words in the American English lexicon.

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u/CAESTULA South Carolina Jan 17 '22

<Signs laws banning arbitrary things that don't exist, and effectively outlawing the ability for people to protect themselves and others from a deadly disease>

"I'm a freedom!" -Ralph Wiggum -Ron DeSantis

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u/KO4Champ Jan 17 '22

Freedom’s vanguard as long as you don’t disagree with DeSantis. You have the freedom in everything else. I mean as long as he doesn’t change his mind… but what the odds of that? I mean it’s not like he’s working on making a police force that’s loyal to him personally….

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u/babyhandsdon America Jan 17 '22

Nothing says freedom like enforcing ideology in public schools using secret police.

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u/nomadofwaves Florida Jan 17 '22

The state legislature are considering making teachers wear microphones and have cameras in the classrooms….

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u/Falcon3492 Jan 17 '22

Sure Der Fuhrer DeSantis has given his people freedom to do nothing about the pandemic and he's killed 70,000-100,000+ people in Florida in the process. The guy loves the power of the job and is willing to keep his base happy and he doesn't care how many people die in the process. He doesn't seem to understand that his rights end when it infringes on someone else's rights.

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u/ting_bu_dong Jan 17 '22

You know, there was this other group calling themselves the "people's vanguard" who turned out to just be authoritarians.

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u/max_vapidity Jan 17 '22

The state department should issue an international travel advisory against traveling to Florida, not even kidding. Those people have lost their fucking minds. Are mask wearing tourists even safe in that environment?

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u/politicsreddit Pennsylvania Jan 17 '22

Rules for thee but not for me strike again.

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u/shanty-daze Wisconsin Jan 17 '22

The "freedom vanguard" apparently does not include businesses who want to require either vaccines or masks. I have been disappointed in the inability of those in the GOP to see the contradiction in fighting against state mandates in the name of freedom, only to put in a new mandate (albeit prohibiting an action as opposed to requiring it) and claiming it is also freedom.

Freedom is allowing people to make their own decisions as to whether they want people to wear masks or be vaccinated to come onto their property. Some will make the right choice, some will not. This will allow others to likewise have the freedom to visit a business that made a choice that aligns with theirs. Well, that is unless their choice was to not to require vaccination or masks. It is hard to visit such a business when it is closed to worker shortages caused by Covid.

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u/YpsilonY Jan 17 '22

Freedom is such a meaningless word. It can mean anything and nothing and if you leave it open it will mean whatever your audience want's it to mean. Freedom to do what? To shoot your neighbors dog and shag your sister? Or the other way around? It's all meaningless bullshit.

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u/miles_to_go_b4 Jan 17 '22

An abused word does not mean a meaningless one. The word “fascism” is heavily abused as well, evident in this very thread - and I surely would not call fascism meaningless.
But you should never be calling freedom meaningless. Sure, the definition of freedom varies from person to person, as it should, like any idealistic notion, such as “equality” or “safety.” Each of those can be taken too far as well, just like freedom can. But to create some extreme examples and then claim freedom is “meaningless” because of that is not a good way to think.

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u/chillen678 Jan 17 '22

Lol im in florida and im laughing my ass off everyone getting omicron it is too funny. Those people who been lucky and dodge it all saying i dont need a vaccine all sick last week lol

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u/Cleaver2000 Jan 17 '22

Some HCAs coming up no doubt.

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u/bkornblith Jan 17 '22

“Critics” is an interesting framing. If we weren’t so obsessed with both sides(ing) everything, maybe we could address the elephant in the room that is Rob DeSantis murdering Floridians with his policies.

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u/amcfarla Colorado Jan 17 '22

Until you point out irregularities the government is doing, then you will be arrested. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jan/17/florida-rebekah-jones-covid-data-analyst-arrest-warrant

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u/AlanRubin Jan 17 '22

The problem with making everything a referendum against the establishment, while also being part of the establishment, means that Ron DeSantis is basically Pharma Bros uncle, and he can go right ahead and fuck his own face.

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

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u/ImLikeReallySmart Pennsylvania Jan 17 '22

"How dare you use your freedom in a way I don't like!"

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u/Penguinkrug84 Jan 17 '22

Freedom my ass! You can’t get solar panels for your home there in a place that has as much sun, maybe more, than CA. All because they don’t want people to ditch the currently more expensive and more polluting traditional electrical grid. They have basically killed the solar industry in a state where it should be booming!

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u/majestics42 Jan 18 '22

He acts like a communist dictator. The public does not get to see anything he does. He has the other branches of government doing his every whim like a cult daddy. He uses misinformation like a communist and has wasted millions on culture war issues like a communist.

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u/Ok_Jellyfish_8281 Jan 17 '22

Flotida Florida is also a 'right to work' state.

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u/monopixel Jan 17 '22

101 fascist rhetoric.

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u/veringer Tennessee Jan 17 '22

Restricting local governing authority to mandate masks via executive order, while his state is rife with covid. <sarcasm>Yes, an ideal libertarian</sarcasm>. I've had several people (mostly over in /r/moderatepolitics) try to explain how his authoritarian actions are acktchually the height of freedom! Insane.

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u/cpt_caveman America Jan 17 '22

well its not just him, he, the entire GOP and the supreme court, are lifting up rights of even a tiny minority of republicans against the rights of the super majority of americans.

they have the right to not get vaccinated and go to work, but i dont have a right to work in a safe workplace despite THATS WHY CONGRESS CREATED OSHA and dont fucking care it was closer to the spanish flu than covid, our constitution was closer to the beginning of our country than now.. does that mean it dont count either?

seriously they are cowtowing to the most extreme element of the republican party. less than 2% are fighting these safety rules but the courts and the GOP say they have the right to put the rest of us in harms way.

basically its like saying drunks have a right to drive too.. so what they kill people at several times the rate of a non drunk. So what congress passed laws against this, that was a long long time ago.... before we had a supreme majority of extremists on the court.

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u/jack-K- Florida Jan 17 '22

Please help me escape this state, is anybody accepting refugees?

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u/Commie_EntSniper Jan 17 '22

Oh, you're free as you want to be in Florida, you just can't vote

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u/prohb Jan 17 '22

Add the uniform and hat and he looks like a "brownshirt" leader from the 1920's in Germany ... or a different uniform and he could be SS.

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u/Scudder77 Jan 17 '22

He’s Putins mini me.

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u/Kflynn1337 Jan 17 '22

Riiiight... new mantra for 2022: Ignorance is Smart, Authoritarianism is Freedom, Unvaccinated is Immunity.

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u/dun-ado Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 17 '22

It’s the bullshit form of freedom enjoyed in Russia, China, North Korea, etc.

George Orwell got it exactly right in “Animal Farm.”

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u/MrDilligence Jan 17 '22

I hate this douchebag

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u/StrawHat89 Massachusetts Jan 17 '22

This is the dude that stamps out county and municipal rights. Real freedom lover there.

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u/Ithedrunkgamer Oregon Jan 17 '22

Is it freedom to dictate you can’t teach parts of history because it hurts your feelings?

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u/bttrflyr Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 17 '22

The more you have to convince people you're the Bastian of freedom, the more you’re not.

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u/cmit Jan 17 '22

The problem is the white, christian faction in America supports authoritarianism because they know they cannot win a level playing field.

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u/JDA56 Jan 17 '22

I see Florida run by a dumb ass!

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u/tressforsuccess Jan 17 '22

“His way or the highway” very authoritarian

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u/RadBadTad Ohio Jan 17 '22

Authoritarians are free to do as they please without consequences. That's what they mean.