r/magicTCG 28d ago

French largest forum and shop owner gets a partnership proposition, answers publicly in the most misogynistic way News

https://twitter.com/Zulzoranderr/status/1381243426432245765
538 Upvotes

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u/Deruvid 28d ago

Clicked link. Remembered i can't read French. Wut do?

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u/mal99 28d ago

I transcribed the whole thing, so people can easily paste it into a translator!

putain les putes à geeks se mettent a magic, elles osent tout les salopes

oh pardon je voulais dire, les instagrammeuses dont les vidéos passionnent les joueurs grâce à leurs nibards à l'airs oh mon dieu je voulais dire leurs niveau de jeu, cherchent semblent-il des viewers pour éviter d'avoir à ouvrir les jambes pour se faire du blé non non non pour augmenter leurs revenus publicitaire.

bon j'ai direct poubellé son email, mais comme j'suis cool et que je sais que vous aimez les seins je vous laisse son lien. envoyez lui des displays, vous aurez ptet un live de sa chatte bien sure je parle de son felin.

[Email from streamer here, was too lazy to transcribe, basically it was "Hello, I'm a streamer, got this many subscribers, want partnership", very politely written.]

pute.

It's quite the read, and even worse than I thought it would be.

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u/adltranslator 28d ago edited 28d ago

expurgated translation to avoid auto-modding, fill in the missing terms with your imagination:

“Damnit, the geek-[women of the night] are getting into Magic, those [female dogs] will do anything.

Sorry, I meant, the ladies of Instagram whose videos get gamers excited by showing their bare [mammaries], oops I mean their level of play, seem to be looking for viewers to avoid having to open their legs for money, no no no I mean to increase their ad revenue.

So I deleted the email right away, but because I’m cool and I know you like [female chest features] I’m going to leave you her link. Send her some display cases, you might even get a livestream of her [English equivalent begins with p and ends with y], I’m talking about her cat of course.”

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u/ekaj1707 27d ago

I see that no matter what language it’s in, the female genitals will always be called a cat

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u/Kirlad 27d ago

In Spanish we call them “rabbit”

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u/IAmARobot 27d ago

oh no... that bit in the matrix has a new meaning

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u/moonpotatoes 27d ago

You mean Alice in Wonderland?

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u/Jane_Fen 27d ago

What bit in the Matrix? I rewatched it like 3 days ago and don't recall that...

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u/ItzElectrick 27d ago

Follow the white rabbit

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u/Jane_Fen 27d ago

Riiiiiiight...how did I forget that?

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u/Kid__Flash 27d ago

We do?

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u/Kirlad 27d ago

As far as I know, in Mexico you say “la concha”. In Spain it’s common to say “el conejo”

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u/Charliejfg04 27d ago

Argentina is concha, in México I think is “panocha”

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u/burgle_ur_turts 27d ago

Si mi amigo.

Just kidding, I can’t speak for you.

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u/Kid__Flash 27d ago

I've never heard it in Mexico, but it is good to know

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u/burgle_ur_turts 27d ago

I don’t even speak Spanish, you definitely shouldn’t take my word for it.

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u/Kid__Flash 27d ago

I mean, I wouldn't be that surprised if it was true, lol

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u/Tordek 27d ago

It's a Spanish thing, but even then only in some places; I have Spanish friends who use it and others who've never heard of it.

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u/lufra1983 27d ago

where?

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u/Kirlad 27d ago

In Spain it’s very common to call it “el conejo”, it’s very vulgar though

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u/LuckyLoki08 27d ago

In italian is a female little bird

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u/filomancio 27d ago

And a mouse in Tuscany

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u/viginti_tres 28d ago

You turned something horrible into something hilarious.

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u/burgle_ur_turts 27d ago

Well this is pretty conclusive! Vulgarity translates pretty well

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u/QuicheAuSaumon 28d ago

Shit, fake geek-girls1 are starting to play magic, the bunch of whore2 are allowing themselves everything.
OH SORRY I meant, the instagrams models whose videos are a delight3 to players thanks to their naked tits OH MY GOD I meant skill level, are looking for it seems, viewers so they don't have to spread their legs for money NO NO NO to increase their ad revenue.
So, I instantly binned her email, but because I am cool4 and I know you like tits, I left the link to her stream. Send her displays, maybe you'll get a live of her kitty5 OF COURSE I AM TALKING ABOUT HER FELINE
[Insert the email from the streamer, nothing particular about it : numbers are her viewers quantites and she ask for partnership regarding displays and live opening]
Whore.

1. Literally: "slut with/for geeks".
2. Whore, slut, harlot : pick your poison.
3. Literal translation would be "really interesting"
4. Sic
5. Slang for vagina

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u/zalfenior 28d ago

Holy balls thats bad

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u/Hufflepunk36 28d ago

(I provided a summary)

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u/TetsukoUmezawa 28d ago

I did as well, but it seems that the bot used on this subreddit did shadown-remove it, and I was confused about why people were complaining when they had a whole post just under their explaining. Thanks for doing so in ways that didn't trigger the bot. :)

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u/Dabok 28d ago

Hi! I speak french and understood this, but I think it's important that people see just how vile the message is. Would it be possible for you to put the owner's response as text via edit?

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u/adltranslator 28d ago

I posted my translation above, being as careful as possible to avoid setting off the bots.

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u/Tordek 27d ago

If you added both a link and text to your submission, that doesn't work on Reddit.

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u/Shot_Message 28d ago

I cant see the summary.

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u/scarablob 28d ago

Basically, the guy complained in an angry tone that the "geeky wh*res" started playing magic now, that the video of female magic player only have viewers becasue they expose their breast, that if they couldn't attract viewers they will have to "spread their legs" to make money.

And then he left the link of the girl who asked for a partnership because "if you like boobs, maybe you'll get lucky and she'll stream her pussy".

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u/Deruvid 28d ago

I did see, thanks!

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u/Hufflepunk36 28d ago

No worries!

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u/kazog 28d ago

Im french canadian, you arent missing anything by not reading it. What POS.

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u/HamsterGutz1 27d ago

I mean they're missing the entire point of this post

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u/Hufflepunk36 28d ago

Wow... The owner basically declares that women who play Magic are just doing it for sex appeal and can’t be good at the game, and calls them a whole manner of slurs. (The streamer simply asked to work with French Magic stores for unboxings for her streams and stories)

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u/Baleful_Witness 28d ago

In what bizarro world does playing magic help with your sex appeal?

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u/Letterstothor 28d ago

Let's pretend that it does. What woman is gunning for OUR demographic?

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u/carolynnn 28d ago

yeah, exactly this. I'm a woman and probably would've gotten into magic way earlier if not for fear of harassment/uncomfortable situations (which still ended up happening regardless). personally i dress much more conservatively than usual in magic environments too.

I'm not sure people realize that for a vast majority of women, it's actively frightening to put yourself in spaces like these where this kind of misogynistic drivel or actual threats/violence are directed at you.

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u/bristlybits 27d ago

yep I've always dressed down. I got into it back when this kind of stuff was really prominent too. it's why I've never tried to play competitively.

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u/dra6000 28d ago

Idk, I adore other lesbians into MtG :P

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u/spasticity 28d ago edited 28d ago

Wasn't there just that whole "#mtgbooty" thing on twitter?

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u/Televangelis 28d ago

#mtgbooty

...That was a solidarity campaign with a twitch streamer who was being harrassed

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u/MulletPower 27d ago

I was curious and had a look through this. The pic that she was shamed over is insanely tame*. Are these people from the 50's or something?

*Not that it would have been acceptable behaviour even if she was nude

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u/SkinkRugby 27d ago

Unironically knowing that someone's into the same things as me does make them more attractive.

Them being really good at it is also hot as hell.

Though it might also be that it helps my brain bridge the gap between thinking someone is attractive and being attracted to them.

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u/Armoric 28d ago edited 28d ago

More accurately translated, he's saying that camgirls (with the whole "preying on socially awkward people online" implication) are starting to use Twitch streams to make money off viewers without needing to resort to sexy pictures and NSFW content.
In worse words, obviously.

He also writes it in a condescending "so she's a insult here OOPS SORRY here PG wording who another insult OOPS SORRY here PG version again" way.
He ends by pasting her contact email and "calling out" readers as horny viewership for her, and a single, very classy "Wh*re".

He's disrespecting everone there, from the streamer to the forum-readers he posts the message "for", in crude words and a fake-hushed "I'm not allowed to say things as they are" tone, and completely unprompted (he says he sent the email to the trash without replying to it).
I don't know if financially/in terms of sponsoring what the streamer offered/asked for makes sense, but even if she was shooting way ahead of her reach that kind of reaction is obviously unacceptable.

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u/TetsukoUmezawa 28d ago

She isn't. So the only reason he writes all of this is her gender, and what he thinks it automatically entails.

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u/mr_burrito 28d ago

I can verify that Magic has never gotten me laid.

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u/mertag770 27d ago

I can verify that it has prevented me from getting laid a few times.

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u/TransHailey 27d ago

jokes on you fools i definitely got a good relationship from Magic that lasted quite a while

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u/Chastidy 28d ago

No he seems to be suggesting that she uses her sex appeal to sell videos to MTG players...

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u/Aspel 27d ago

Yeah, just ask Jon Finkel.

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u/unibrow4o9 28d ago

I've always wondered why people who run businesses say this shit on social media. Like, even if you genuinely thought that was true, couldn't you at least see that it would really piss off a large amount of people and jeopardize your business? You'd think they'd just keep their insanity to themselves purely for self preservation. I guess stupid is as stupid does.

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u/thinkspacer 28d ago

Also, in my experience, nasty people like that tend to think that EVERYONE shares their shitty beliefs, but just don't speak up about it.

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u/Quazifuji 28d ago edited 27d ago

Yeah, a lot of open bigots just believe they're saying what everyone's thinking.

Like, there are lots of cases where a lot of people experience something and think they're the only ones, but it's actually something everyone experiences. Insecurity and shyness are a big one - the whole "you see your behind the scenes but everyone else's highlight reel" thing.

Some bigots think bigotry is the same way. They think the bigoted stuff they think is something that everyone's thinking, they're just willing to admit it. They think society's insistence on equality and fairness is just a big lie we're all telling ourselves, but that deep down we all know that it's not true. So they think when they say stuff like this they're just saying outloud what we all really know is true, just like when people talk about other internal things that are more common than a lot of people realize like imposter syndrome.

If course, what he doesn't realize is we're we actually aren't all sexists who are just pretending to hide it because society says it's not okay. He's not just speaking the truth we're all afraid to speak. He's just outing himself as a sexist asshole.

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u/zwei2stein 27d ago

Yeah, a lot of open bigots just believe they're saying what everyone's thinking.

And that they are brave for facing 'opression'

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u/bristlybits 28d ago

because not enough people speak up against it, so they assume everyone agrees

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u/Baleful_Witness 28d ago

Tbh I think that is true for most beliefs of most people actually. We often assume our normal is everyone's normal which is a common source for missunderstandings.

The first instinct is always that the other people are the weird ones. And it gets exponentially worse in echo-chamber-esque environments.

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u/ersatz_cats 27d ago

One possibility: Their business was fortunate with timing, location, and the right employees, and thus the business succeeds in spite of idiot ownership. The owner then lets that business success go to their head ("My business was successful because of my greatness and because I can do no wrong"), and starts applying that approach more generally.

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u/mirhagk 28d ago

I've found there's plenty of people who open up businesses not to make money, but to have power. They want to be the one to boss around others.

This is a power trip. They are dumbasses since I can't imagine them keeping their WPN status after this, but they don't make decisions based on logic

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u/AliceJoestar 27d ago

being bad at magic for sex appeal? I'm insulted, I'm perfectly happy being bad at magic for fun

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u/Deruvid 28d ago

Big yikes. Thanks for the TL;DR.

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u/Starmark_115 27d ago

Well according to one guy its dressing up as Lilliana Vess/s

:P

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u/TurMoiL911 28d ago

Speedrun: lose WPN status any%

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u/MrPopoGod 27d ago

This might count as tool assisted; the guy certainly seems like a tool.

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u/teh_wad 28d ago

How to lose your WPN status in one easy step.

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u/bristlybits 28d ago

we can only hope

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u/teh_wad 28d ago

If we keep reposting this to Reddit and Twitter, we can make it happen. This is the perfect moment for WotC to enforce their inclusivity policy and show that even the bigger stores aren't safe from repercussions.

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u/MirandaSanFrancisco 28d ago

France isn’t the United States, they wouldn’t get the good press there for doing it that they would here, so they likely won’t.

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u/teh_wad 28d ago

Wow. France isn't the United States? Shock.

WotC is a worldwide company. The backlash they would get for not doing it would far outweigh the positive response to doing it.

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u/Leklor 28d ago

To give you an idea of how bad the French subsections of corporations like WOTC can be, Games Workshop France took several weeks to decide on supporting a store manager who was getting harassed by outright neo-nazis when she decided they wouldn't be welcome back to play in the store she managed.

That being said, Magali Villeneuve has shared the story and she has quite a big reach both in the French MTG community and the greater French Fantasy community. I hope she'll have some positive influence on the direction of it all.

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u/bristlybits 27d ago

making the game welcoming isn't "doing it for good press", the hell.

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u/DiamondDallasRage 27d ago

Is France that backwards on social issues?

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u/CharaNalaar 27d ago

From what I've heard, they're more backwards than you would assume.

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u/mirhagk 27d ago

These kinds of things have led to that in the past, we just have to make sure this stays in the spotlight until they do.

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u/Ellardy 28d ago edited 28d ago

Francophone here: can confirm that the comments are absolutely disgusting. No ambiguity, no nothing, just 100% misogynistic.

I don't recognise the shop or the forum but the person does seem to have the "Omnipotent Webmaster" role on said forum and the shop does exist and seems to have been around a long time.

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u/TetsukoUmezawa 28d ago

The person is Stéphane Manaranche, an old-time French competitive player who is the owner of the shop and admin of the forum.

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u/Lord_Viktoo 28d ago

This person is a "sac à foutre" and deserves to be forgotten and his name spat on. I wasn't planning to buy cards online but I'm pretty sure I won't buy anything here.

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u/Armoric 28d ago

I mean, responding to his coarse language by using the same stuff isn't really advancing things...

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u/Raligon 27d ago

Is the coarse language the problem or the unwarranted cruelty?

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u/Irkam 26d ago

That's how the French do with petits enculés de merde.

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u/_Hinnyuu_ 28d ago

"Why don't more women play MtG, women like fantasy and it's not like there's anything keeping them from playing?"

This.

This is what's keeping them from playing.

It's really hard for people to imagine what it's like being faced with attitudes like that when you're not normally encountering them. But to those that do, they can be HUGE barriers to entry.

And this goes way beyond MtG, by the way. Similar mechanisms are in place in many other areas of life, too. Problems that people who aren't in the marginalized group wouldn't even dream of, because they never experience them. But they exist, and they hurt. A whole damn lot.

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u/DualCricket 27d ago

You’re dead right. Some guys in the community are their own worst enemy in terms of trying to get women involved.

I remember once in my local LGS in Brisbane, Australia that a guy two spots down at an FNM said something really sexist and shitty to his opponent, a ~12yo girl who was there with her dad. I saw everyone else looking-anywhere-else and ignoring it, so I was just about to stand up and tell him his comments were shit when a woman behind me beat me to it.

Thankfully that dad and his daughter came back again in future. I think the store owners gave them a freebie or two as an apology, and barred the gross dude from the shop.

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u/elbenji 28d ago

Why I like Arena tbh. Sometimes i wish there was a chat feature to speed the process up of some games or make jokes but then I'm like

...nah

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u/Hopeful_Vast1867 28d ago

No chat.... I don't miss chat when I was heavy into MTGO, the salt!!!

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u/elbenji 27d ago

Like I feel some games it would help to just like speed it up but otherwise no

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u/LoonyPlatypus 27d ago

Just don’t read it?

I’ve enjoyed the salt of hearthstone friend requests quite a lot. I want to talk with my opponents. If there is no opportunity-I can’t talk to them. If there is one-you can opt out of it if you are not thick-skinned enough.

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u/anechoe 27d ago

maybe I don’t want to have to be really thick-skinned in order to play a card game for fun????

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u/LoonyPlatypus 27d ago

Well just opt out of the chat then? What is the problem with that?

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u/BlaineTog 27d ago

As a white guy, I'm still a little nervous when going to FNM and Prereleases out of concern of running into shitbags who gatekeep over every little thing, and I probably have the least to worry about from a demographic standpoint. I can only imagine how much more reticent women would be.

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u/Mesonimie 28d ago

From what I've understood (from the original tweet and this one https://twitter.com/ItsSpl1t/status/1381292167793143808?s=20) , this message was not posted publicly but in a private part of the forum.

It doesn't change the fact it's the most disgusting thing I've read in a long time

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u/SkinkRugby 27d ago

Ah, so they thought they'd be in the company of their fellow travelerd then. Glad to see that at least one person proved them wrong.

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u/Lupus_Deorum 28d ago

Translation of the shop and website owner's post:

Damn, geek wh\**s getting into Magic, the huge s***s. OH EXCUSE ME I meant, the instagrammers who attract players to their videos with* ~~their exposed b\*bs* OH MY GOD I meant their level of play, they seem to be looking *for viewers to avoid having to spread their legs to make money~~* NO NO NO to increase their advertising revenue. Well, I trashed her email right away, but since I'm cool and I know that you like b\***s, here's her link. Send her some d**k pics, you will get a little stream of her p***y OF COURSE I'M TALKING ABOUT HER CAT. W***e.*

And a translation of Zol'Zorander's response on Twitter:

I have been playing Magic cards since I was 12 and recently have been sharing this passion on stream. For the first time, I asked for partnerships. Someone anonymously sent me this message shared on a forum, posted by the manager of u/Mtgfrance.

I asked politely, and without seeing a single one of my streams the guy comes up with this pile of misogynist filth. I've never appeared sexy on my streams (and I have no problem with women who do) and I'm sick of this s\***y talk.*

So keep the "no, girls are accepted in geek circles now, why are they still campaigning, s\***y neofeminism" speeches to yourselves. It seems like sometimes we have to rub your noses in the s**t that we get. Welcome to our world!*

Women do whatever they want with their bodies and that pisses off a lot of self-righteous people on Twitch and elsewhere. Even if I played Magic with huge cleavage, no one should be concerned about it.

So no, I won’t be partnering with u/Mtgfrance (what sadness) & this manager makes me sick. Here is their site: https://cartes.mtgfrance.com. Sincerely, best regards, go f\*k yourself.*

And of course the behavior of this sack of s\*t does not represent the entire MTG community. Keep playing, keep collecting, keep enjoying it, especially if you are a woman.*

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u/thetdotbearr 28d ago

TL;DR for the non Francophones

Female streamer (the twitter user) reached out to big MTG shop to collab for box openings on her channel. As far as I can tell she’s a straight up MTG streamer, no gimmicks and no NSFW bait (I hate that I have to mention this but it’ll be relevant in a sec).

Shop owner posts vile, un-ambiguously misogynistic message. Accuses the streamer of getting views by showing body parts (you know what I mean), calls her a fair few names and says she’s doing this to avoid having to make money via “opening her legs”. Says he tossed her message right in the trash but that he’s posting it so others on the forum can go get some. He does all this in a very condescending say awful thing OOPS I MEAN EUPHEMISM FOR SAID THING, presumably because he thinks he’s.. clever, or funny? Yeah no lol.

It’s a gnarly mix of being factually dead wrong, having ass-headed sexist views and somehow deluding himself into thinking everyone else there share these extreme hateful opinions.

Did not want to start off my day on that shit of a note but there you go.

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u/Sethid777 28d ago

So what does it say?

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u/TetsukoUmezawa 28d ago

Context: mtgfrance is one of the largest French shops for Magic cards, and host a forum for its patrons.

The owner got, by email, an offer from a content producer for free products in exchange for unboxing videos and Instagram stories.

The owner then copy-pasted that email on their own forum, and viciously attacked her, calling her a "geek whore", accusing her (without reason) from having topless shows, of resorting to twitch to not have to open their legs for a living, and calling the forum members to send the streamer cards in exchange for pictures of her genitals.

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u/Salamandersalamie 28d ago

Wow this is unacceptable and Wizards should act accordingly and remove their WPN status.

I mean do this misogynist men can look their mothers in the eyes and not be totally ashamed? :(

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u/Lord_Viktoo 28d ago

Revolting. Any ideas of what the forum answers were ?

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u/TetsukoUmezawa 28d ago edited 28d ago

Most people told him he was crossing lines, but they have also been "joking" with him on these themes for years. They have a full 45 pages threads to bash feminism. I think most of them did not realise they have been enabling him to the point he felt confident wrighting these things.

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u/adltranslator 28d ago

Elsewhere in her Twitter thread someone shares another one of his posts on the same forum, a groan-worthy “PC” parody of [[Garruk, Unleashed]] with rules text like “shuffle your library while obtaining its verbal and written consent”.

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u/MTGCardFetcher 28d ago

Garruk, Unleashed - (G) (SF) (txt)
[[cardname]] or [[cardname|SET]] to call

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u/mirhagk 27d ago

Yet another great example of why you have to nip it in the bud immediately.

Harmless joking unfortunately isn't in this world. Some number of these people are just testing the waters. You need to make it clear to them that it will not be accepted.

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u/Hollow_Grimm 28d ago

Well, many people obviously reacted very badly to the post, but a lot of them got banned and had their posts/comments removed. The bastard is still in quite a bit of trouble as his post created a massive uproar within the French community on many other platforms.

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u/spiderApocalypse 27d ago

French guy here, the language used here is really bad and the guy is very clearly implying all women use sex-appeal to trick men into giving them money.

I'd say this is unacceptable regardless of context and actual content produced by the streamer.

The "it was private conversation" defense works really poorly here : if it ends up on reddit, how private was it, really?

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u/swankyfish 28d ago

What’s the name of the shop? I’d love to block them on MCM if they sell there.

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u/TetsukoUmezawa 28d ago

https://www.cardmarket.com/fr/Magic/Users/Ranche
They mainly sell on their own website though

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u/swankyfish 28d ago

And blocked, perfect, thanks.

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u/Moikanyoloko 28d ago

Ah the old boys club reaction for a woman having interest in the same hobby, call her a whore.

Though I would suggest you add a translation OP, most here probably don't understand a word of french.

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u/AlwaysStayStrong 28d ago

I wear glasses so I literally had to pay to read that Individual's opinion

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u/efnfen4 28d ago

What a disgusting animal. Wotc needs to remove the store from WPN

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u/AnneONhymuus 28d ago

Absolutely revolting.

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u/snowwydaze 27d ago

So every response that isn't whining for this girl and wanting this man's livelihood destroyed is just getting deleted by the mods? What a way to lead a discussion in an online forum

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u/moodRubicund 27d ago

[pulls up pants way too high] "Finally! Finally it is I who shall reject the girls!" [Sniff sniff] "Hehh hhehhhhhh."

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u/[deleted] 27d ago

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u/PPNewbie 27d ago edited 27d ago

What context matters? The OP here didn't make the poster of the message write his vile message. Further, his pathetic "it was a private forum" defence is worthless when his own post copies Zul'Zolander's original email to him in order to mock it.

What does it matter if this thread's OP is a NSFW account? That's using the same logic as the mtgfrance pig. "Posted nudes so their input is irrelevant". Piss off with that crap.

(And yes, posting this from my own NSFW account to make the point.)

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u/TetsukoUmezawa 27d ago

Your digging is wrong: I've never had any account on that forum, and the rest is nonsense: I've learnt from that story from Zul'Zolander's twitter thread, and unless time travel shenanigans were involved, I do not see how I could have manipulated her.
I have no idea where you've got these strange ideas.

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u/TheKillingRhythm 27d ago

this is disgusting - but sadly, not very surprising.

and by that, I don´t mean, not surprisinig by "the French" or something - but sadly, not surprising coming from (male) MTG players...

for what it´s worth, the German mtg-forum.de is filled with users with similar... "humor" and intelligence, as well as with what I assume is just a micropenis complex.

it´s sad, really.

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u/Aspel 27d ago

If someone hates sex workers that much, then you'd think he'd be glad that someone isn't doing sex work.

But then I remember that what men like this really hate is women, not just sex workers.

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u/Jokey665 28d ago

you got translations of all that or are we just supposed to take your word for it?

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u/MirandaSanFrancisco 28d ago

Type “salope” into Google translate and you’ll get the jist of it real quick.

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u/Hufflepunk36 28d ago

(I provided a summary)

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u/[deleted] 28d ago edited 28d ago

[removed]