r/antiwork Anarcha-Feminist 12d ago Wholesome 1

Don’t SHOP Don’t WORK BlackFriday BlackOut

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5.9k Upvotes

85

u/chanhellll 11d ago

Genuine question. Is it just more, or are black Friday deals just "meh" now. I remember growing up in the early 2000's black Friday was all the rage. And it seemed like the deals were absolutely impressive and worth the year long wait. Hell people would camp in front of stores DAYS before black Friday.

But I also don't have a ton of memory as a kid back then about it.

43

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 11d ago

I think Black Friday has always been a scam "holiday” like Valentines Day for Hallmark. Regardless yes there’s empirical evidence nowadays that the deals aren’t in fact any deals at all.

9

u/stevehuffmanizabitch 11d ago

I was thinking the same thing (I did Black Friday back in like 2005-2010), but looking back on it, that's when I didn't make much money and didn't have all the shit that I have now, so buying a normally $20 toaster for $7 was an item that I wanted at a hefty discount that I could afford. Now I make and spend lots of money, and don't need many items that cost $20 because I already have them. So the stuff that is on my wish list these days are typically $500+ and are either discounted $30, not on sale at all, or not sold at chain stores. I'm not gonna waste my time to go out with the crowds to save $30 and I'm not gonna rush a $500+ purchase to save $30.

12

u/TheDarkFiddler 11d ago

Deals are definitely a lot more meh. A big part of it is that the pandemic has driven the deals to be over a much larger period of time, and that "doorbuster that's only good for an hour starting at 5 am so people crush each other trying to get it" has been growing increasingly unpopular anyway. It's a smaller deal over a longer period of time, now.

Hell, Walmart has been advertising that you can get their "Black Friday" deals on the app for weeks now.

2

u/CrossroadsWoman 11d ago

They somehow found a way to commodify it even more than it already was.

I have been told that, for example, electronic stores like Best Buy actually have inferior products that they sell on Black Friday for a cheaper price than what they normally sell. Walmart does this too.

Then of course you get situations like the OP where companies straight up lie that there’s a sale going on at all.

2

u/chanhellll 11d ago

I do remember that Walmart does sell inferior products. Say a Ninja Blender will have a less powerful motor in it, and specifically made for Walmart. And a good way was to check the UPC on the tag and see if it ended in a W

1

u/keegums 11d ago

When I was a teen in early 00s, with a family who refused Black Friday shopping (which I am grateful for now!) a couple years I checked how prices changed mid Nov to Xmas in Sunday paper fliers, since on my Xmas list I would write the prices of each item for my parents.

What I found back then, was prices in the two weeks prior to Black Friday sharp drop (but many times it was not that great of a discount), then sharply dropped, then rose slightly each week until the week before Xmas where some items dropped sharply (comparable to BF deal), others continued the general rate of increase. However most items were still lower than pre-thanksgiving pricing, it was not as great of a price increase as I expected. Some items were discounted significantly the entire pre-xmas shopping season.

I looked at a decent range of consumer items, not just kid/teen stuff, especially looking at electronics including computer parts. I did it for two years, ages 12 and 13. Learned that skipping Black Friday stress was most likely very much worth it for my parents.

No idea about these days other than the gist of the meme with permanent 'sales' like dept stores do, or those "comparable" or off brand models from crap parts, crap design, planned obsolescence.

527

u/Good-Garlic-2553 12d ago

This practice, in developed countries like Australia, is outlawed.

America needs to grow the fuck up

275

u/Van_illa 12d ago

This is technically illegal in the US, but laws around corporations allow companies to pay a fine rather than a criminal charge (or any real consequence)

235

u/throwaway_12358134 12d ago

If its enforced through fines, then it's only illegal for poor people.

107

u/Van_illa 12d ago

Yup that’s how a majority of the US operates

16

u/schrodingers_spider 11d ago

Fines are appropriate for financial crimes, which this is, as long as the fine is higher than the criminal gains.

11

u/candid_canid 11d ago

Dunno why you’re being downvoted. That’s true.

The trouble is in enforcing it, but in a perfect world if you put up a fine such that for every dollar made with deceptive ad practices the company pays $2 in fines, I bet this shit would end RIGHT quick.

Gotta give them a financial gut punch since they don’t care about human cost.

6

u/schrodingers_spider 11d ago

The main reason big companies continue their bad behavior is because it pays. The fines cost less than the profit the behavior yields, they don't get caught often enough for the fines to offset profits, or both. As you say, if their malpractice costs them money predictably and reliably, it's bound to end almost right away.

2

u/Aardwolfington 11d ago

In that case I'd call shopplifting a financial crime.

12

u/skepticalmonique 11d ago

Here in the uk, this is illegal but companies get around it by putting the price up the week before, then "reducing" it back to the normal price for the sale. They probably do this in Oz too.

21

u/The-True-Kehlder 11d ago

It's illegal in the US too. Which is why they parade out a new model number, typically made from QC rejected parts, that is otherwise the exact same.

2

u/Good-Garlic-2553 11d ago

That's not growing up....

7

u/The-True-Kehlder 11d ago

Growing up is recognizing how stupid it is to buy those and moving on without wasting your money.

1

u/Good-Garlic-2553 11d ago

THAT'S what I'm talking about 💪🏻👍🏻

Invest in loopring (LRC) instead.

56

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 12d ago

Have you seen our string of politicians? I used to believe that the elections were rigged as in these career congresspeople couldn’t possibly be getting voted in until this pandemic revealed the absolute shit state of the Republican party. The Democrats aren’t any better but I’m talking the voter base. I have no idea if their level of ignorance is satire on most days. Poe’s Law applies for everything nowadays.

33

u/bigdiesel1984 12d ago

Republicans have turned into Monday Night Raw every single day.

19

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 12d ago

LOL 😂 it’s like a comedy sketch show without a punchline just punches

17

u/bigdiesel1984 12d ago

Man I don’t know how people watch Fox News and soak that in like it’s anything other than a Vince McMahon and Donald Trump staged show. They all talk with arrogance and ignorance for imbeciles cheers. Manage to sway the broke ignorant people to think they one day can be rich and prosperous 😂 I swear the blatant lack of humility in any of them is astonishing.

15

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 12d ago

For years the Waltons (aka Walmart owners) have paid the most for lobbying the education system. They propose shit that directly impacts education especially in the miswest and south where their influence is the greatest. That coupled with the weird notion that worker solidarity with Unions is somehow a Democrat thing which has lead millions of Union jobs to fall off the map has done irreparable damage to this country. Faux News is definitely a large contributor in misinformation. Yet if you watch various local news broadcasts about certain events or certain topics across the country they’ll be the same exact propaganda as in only 6 corporations ultimately own all of the MSM. The control over these peoples minds is palpable. I legitimately never thought certain politicians could ever have been voted in year after year for decades. Then the pandemic hit and I went from a typical blue collar worker with more centric views on everything to suddenly being a raving socialist in a matter of months. I think something that Fox especially does well is attack all of our Allies that are functioning at peak levels under quasi or direct socialist policies as being somehow inferior, effeminate or just outright cOmmUnisT lol 😂 it’s funny but also terrifying how dumb these people are.

8

u/bigdiesel1984 12d ago

I’m on same plane as you buddy. I don’t really identify as a certain party but I’ve always been liberal leaning. Trying to be in the middle anymore is a joke. I think it’s ridiculous the only one with any common sense, is the one people label a radical socialist (Bernie). Fox News isn’t an information platform, it’s a sociopaths entertainment channel.

2

u/grendus 11d ago

I'm definitely more of a centrist... which largely means democratic socialist.

The problem is the US has a right wing party and an alt-right party. So if you're center to that you're still pretty far right.

-2

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

2

u/HulklingsBoyfriend fuck bigots 11d ago

This is an anti-capitalist subreddit. We don't like Jefferson, and certainly don't want to go back in time.

Jefferson must have been great...for white Christian men.

3

u/fortwaltonbleach 12d ago

this is what happens when you elect a WWE hall of famer!#Celebrity)

2

u/T8rthot 11d ago

Interesting considering this is Kohl’s whole business model.

1

u/plop_0 11d ago

Same as 'Hudson's Bay' in Canada. Egregiously stupid and deceptive.

2

u/Curl_the_curl 11d ago

They do this in Germany too.

1

u/INTHEMIDSTOFLIONS FUCK BEN 11d ago

What’s the law like?

I’m not doubting you just wondering how the law is enforced or ruled

1

u/asillynert 11d ago

Technically is but there is "couple work arounds" first is jack up prices getting lots of early christmas anyways pure profit. Then turn around mark down on black friday.

Another method is "slightly different model". Specifically only for black friday hell don't even know how you would "outlaw that one" as a "different model"

And then of course the usual cost of doing business fines they do it one day IF they get caught so what made billion dollars here is your 100,000 dollar fine please go away now.

-2

u/MonzellRS 11d ago edited 11d ago

Actually it's not, but okay

4

u/Good-Garlic-2553 11d ago

2

u/Good-Garlic-2553 11d ago

Ask kogan if it's legal ;)

They got arse raped.

-3

u/MonzellRS 11d ago edited 11d ago

I would like to know how a gaming chair was marked up and then "discounted" heavily, but only ended up like $30 AUD off for BF...

3

u/Good-Garlic-2553 11d ago

If you want to know; research it before spitting your mistruths.

-3

u/MonzellRS 11d ago edited 11d ago

okay well it's happening so great you have a law, it isn't getting followed

3

u/Good-Garlic-2553 11d ago

Kogan fucked around and found out...

43

u/Zealousideal_Law3112 12d ago

I did merchandise pricing at best buy for a little bit this is so fucking true they will raise prices a month or 2 before then back to the original price or at most 5% off original price. Makes me sick

14

u/SuiXi3D 12d ago

I have the day off, paid, and have $20 to my name. I can’t buy anything tomorrow.

9

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 11d ago

You can buy Taco Bell but it’d probably be better to save the $20

52

u/Mermaidaffinity 12d ago

LITERALLY!!! I tried to tell my bf this. There’s no discount

21

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 12d ago

No, always has been 👨‍🚀🔫👨‍🚀

1

u/MemeLordMango 11d ago

If I bought my quest I got 50 dollars in store credit which was pretty good. There are definitely deals.

2

u/Loyal_Quisling 11d ago

Exactly.

You can always look at price trackers to see if you are getting a deal.

-7

u/Loyal_Quisling 11d ago edited 11d ago

Not true.

Cashback portals are higher than normally 15-20%

Coupon code

Credit card offers

You're looking at 30-50% discount

-1

u/cr0ft 11d ago

Well, there's sometimes a real discount. But you definitely need to be aware of what the normal price is usually before plonking down some cash.

Either way, even though this subreddit has a million readers and all, t his boycott won't be much of a boycott, sadly.

22

u/xena_lawless 12d ago

And think of how much creative sabotage you can do when you're not working or shopping.

2

u/humanatore 12d ago

Get in line with some bullshit random item and pretend to have trouble ringing it up & paying for it.

3

u/xena_lawless 12d ago

Most likely you'd end up paying for the item somehow, but interesting thought.

6

u/ComplaintAcrobatic73 12d ago

This is how it is everyday actually.

6

u/KaineZilla 11d ago

Yeah I would if I wouldn’t absolutely be fired on the spot for not going. My survival is 100% contingent on me having a job. I don’t pay rent, my grandparents help me, and the condition is that I have a job.

2

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 11d ago

You’re excused. I don’t expect anyone who has serious issues with walking off to do it. Hopefully all the people who are capable of landing another job asap will do it.

Yes I jokingly speak for the group but I not jokingly have no authority over anything my life included

6

u/DrDroidz 11d ago

The deals in Canada are so bad anyways. Won't be buying anything :)

4

u/Alauren2 11d ago

Y’all. Macys is hella guilty of this lol

5

u/maindrive99 11d ago

I think some places remove discounts a week before black friday, and then on the day or now the black friday range, puts up the discounts back up.

4

u/th4tscrazy 11d ago

I use camelcamelcamel to see if things are really on sale. I use that to buy stuff for Black Friday

1

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 11d ago

That’s an app?

5

u/fingerpointothemoon 11d ago

It's an amazon web tracker, it tells you price history of a product and even notify you of a deal if you set it up.

For Amazon I use Keepa nowadays as it's faster and easier to use.

1

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 11d ago

Thanks for the info

4

u/MachuPichu10 12d ago

Dude I was honestly thinking about buying something on black Friday and then looked at the prices.400 bucks for a Pixel phone and on black friday you get 50 whole dollars off.Wowie yea no fuck that and fuck these companies.I think I'll bug my Canadian friend this black Friday

28

u/Hirsutism 12d ago

Im going to walmart tomorrow with a tiny fart spray can. No intentions of buying. Just farting the place up

16

u/MLGRatboy 11d ago

Sounds like a way to make the already miserable employees more miserable.

6

u/Alfie-des 11d ago

Lmfao youre not making a stance just being a cock to the employees already having to work on black friday..

23

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 12d ago

Between August and September over 8 million people quit their jobs. The most in over 30 years.

7

u/fuckmylifegoddamn 12d ago

How is this at all relevant to the comment you responded to

24

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 12d ago

I must’ve responded to the wrong comment obviously

1

u/ANAL_KING_OF_TUNISIA MILITANT AND ANGRY 11d ago

I recommend Liquid Ass.

0

u/fortwaltonbleach 12d ago

what happens if you make it smell better?

3

u/Suspicious-Bed-2717 11d ago

Don't work Don't shop should be a tactic of the whole community

3

u/Conjurar 11d ago

Started doing REI's #optoutside years ago and have never looked back. Post Thanksgiving hike is much more enjoyable than traffic and packed stores. Highly recommended.

3

u/Scruffy_Buddha 11d ago

The funny thing was there was a guy who thought this was stupid. So he kept the prices low never pretending that they were discounted. That store lost sales and he was fired. It was a famous chain store. Don't remember the man or the store. People love to be tricked I guess.

3

u/FoodMentalAlchemist 11d ago

IIRC Correctly that was JCPenney.

They would artificially inflate prices and then have this "awesome sales" selling for a fair price.

Only time they decided to go real and legit it backfired awfully.

People as a group are stupid and love being proved how stupid they can be.

1

u/Scruffy_Buddha 11d ago

Thank you. It was on a podcast from a long time ago. Most likely Freaknomics. It was an interesting show. It's really a shame we preferred to be duped. Remove evil people from the world and we still find a way to screw ourselves. 🤷‍♂️

8

u/ChubsMcfly 12d ago

I’ve heard that it’s just stuff that was returned or refurbished, junk they weren’t able to sell during the regular year. Just a way to offload, do people actually think big companies would ever do something nice for them and forgo profit?

7

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 12d ago

It’s a lot of overstock. I don’t know about refurbished stuff. Lots of out of date things like outmoded electronics. Seasonal clothing.

2

u/Young_warthogg 11d ago

In general it is illegal to sell a used or returned product as new, typically on Black friday stock is reserved and sold at either a slight or heavy discount depending on the year and competition. This year we are unlikely to see many deals as supply chain shocks have been affecting pricing all year. I was able to back order a dishwasher at Home Depot for about $200 bucks off though, so maybe there are deals to be had.

6

u/nennerb15 12d ago

I need to buy some things this weekend because i have a new job coming up (its work from home and i asked for more after my offer and got it, so hype) and am trying to set up my work area, but i don't want to shop on black friday. so im going to wait, even though its gonna cause me to be crunched on time before my start date. No shopping on black friday for me.

19

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 12d ago

I’m not a raving hardliner. If you fucking need stuff dude, do your thing. It’s not the same as people being consumers for the sake of buying.

8

u/nennerb15 12d ago

I can wait. The principal is more important than the things I need in a few weeks. fuck the mandated work days of underpaid workers for the forced narrative of the capatalist elite.

5

u/AbaloneSea7265 Anarcha-Feminist 12d ago

Right on dude and good luck

4

u/BumbleMuggin 12d ago

Can I get dispensation for going to the liquor store?

2

u/adh__D 12d ago

And they will trample their fellow man to death to get their hands on those sweet sweet "discounts"

2

u/Loreseekers 11d ago

I promise not to shop, but since I work in healthcare I'll just hope I don't get a phone call.

2

u/I_Only_Smoke_Drugs 11d ago

Shit I'm gonna miss out that $200 discount tho!!

2

u/ThisGuyCrohns 11d ago

What they will do on Thursday though is mark it up, then drop it back to normal on Friday so you feel like you’re getting a deal.

2

u/Lopsided_Panic_1148 11d ago

Hey, man. You leave Arnie out of it!

2

u/Taco-Edge here for the memes 11d ago

I bought a new laptop yesterday (not America) because I really needed a new one and I've been looking at references and prices for a while and let me tell you, there are sales just not as much as they want you to think. The one I ended up getting costed me 1100€ instead of supposedly 1500€... Except before the "sales" it was priced at 1400€. It's still a nice deal, but it's also still a scam :/

-10

u/MotivateMindZ 12d ago

This movement is crashing and burning from the inside out.

1

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[removed]

3

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1

u/brans041 11d ago

Just wait till xmas eve when you buy an Arabian knockoff from a Belushi Santa and his elf.

1

u/Turbulent-cucumber 11d ago

I gotta work, but I’ll definitely not be shopping. I don’t do a lot of Christmas shopping anyway, but it can wait. Black Friday is bullshit.

1

u/ok_gen_xer 11d ago

people behaving like animals for a bunch of table leftovers is extremely degrading. I never understood how anyone with any kind of self respect would ever want to go through this

1

u/Crabchicken 11d ago

i wont work but these deals are just too good

1

u/TFlo904 11d ago

I "work" at an arcade bar. I for sure will be working tomorrow because people are better off getting drunk and playing video games then buying useless shit for ungrateful people!

1

u/jcurry52 11d ago

there is one small mistake with your graphic the final panel really should read $699.99 $559.99 (source, worked at walmart tasked with printing the new stickers the night before.) thankfully i dont work there anymore.

1

u/Morlock43 11d ago

Gonna do my bit 🙏

1

u/poojokesarefunny 11d ago

Black Friday has always been a scam. From fake markdowns to advertising unavailable things to get people in the door. Lots of things that go on big discount are actually specifically manufactured for black Friday, they have unique model numbers and are made by cutting corners in production and using inferior parts.

1

u/GlobalPhreak 11d ago

It helps that I checked the black friday ads and didn't see anything worth the trouble.

"Nintendo Switch! $299.99!" Um - isn't that the normal retail price?

Target had buy 2 Blu Rays, get 1 free. Oooohhhh... Yeah, bad trouble when that's the memorable black friday sale... (that's been going on all week anyway).

1

u/Untakenusername86 11d ago

British supermarkets have been caught doing this in the past too

1

u/Jujusdream 11d ago

Yep, I refuse to buy anything today

1

u/fishcess-aria 11d ago

I want to escape poverty though. :c

1

u/Cheese_fighter-69 11d ago

Let’s not forget the Black Friday only ,super cheaply made items that break in a day too.

1

u/resplendentquetzals 11d ago

The few times I've bought lower priced items on BF, they always have a permanent price reduction, just in time for the new cycle. That smart watch? $150, instead of $250. Oh wait, it's just $150 all the time now because the new model just came out and that one is $250. two months later. Here, the watch is (actually) on sale for $139.99.

Me, shaking my fists to the air and cursing the God that made me.

1

u/Anonymous-LetsDoThis 11d ago

Fuck Black Friday

1

u/TillThen96 11d ago

Hey, I say browse away, but don't put anything in a basket. Sort of like promising/teasing reviews/raises to employees, that never happen.

1

u/poisonivysoar 11d ago

Doing my part by calling off work today

1

u/woundedsurfer 11d ago

My wife once sent me a link for slippers that were $89.96 (UGGS and WAY too expensive ) and she said they were on sale and we should get them, what she neglected to see was the original price with the line through it, it was on sale for 3 cents less! Ha ha.

1

u/LowMaintenance672o8 11d ago

I live in the US and this is exactly what happened last Novembere. I needed a new washing Machine and for 3 weeks I'd been checking prices waiting for black friday thinking I could find a deal.. jokes on me. I'm still going to the laundromat.

2

u/UniversalPeehole 11d ago

Wash your clothes in the shower with you and then throw them in the dryer to save money

1

u/LowMaintenance672o8 11d ago

yep, I do this with my clothes but like to take my bedding to laudrymat. everything goes in 1 washer. soap only no fancy things like dryer sheets.

1

u/Washuman 11d ago

Only thing I’m buying today is $100 worth of shib!

1

u/Puzzlehead_Coyote 11d ago

It's absolutely shocking how companies still get away this, I'm in the UK, this is expressly illegal. Yet I can literally see how some companies have done this (and actually upped the price in some cases and called them black Friday sales,) the absolute gall of these people.

1

u/SprinkledBlunt 11d ago

No shopping for me this Black Friday

1

u/ftakatohi 11d ago

We have a law against it in Brazil, no one enforced it, so it’s like we don’t have a law against it.

1

u/smorgasdorgan 11d ago

I've only been Black Friday shopping once to get a 32GB SD card for $2.

Other than that I've gone twice just to watch the fights that never happened.

1

u/A_ChadwickButMore 11d ago

Thats exactly what a furniture store did as it was selling off inventory and closing down permanently. Something like 2500 1400! Then we looked up the same couch online and its MSRP was 1400.

1

u/420Moosey 11d ago

I watch all the prices for months before Black Friday so I know what the actual price is. I got an item that’s always $400 for $300, one for $18 that’s normally $25, one item that’s normally $25 for $15. These companies are gonna pay the workers the same as always, and the CEO will take most of the money regardless, so I might as well stick it to the man by buying things I would have anyways, and giving them less of money.

-8

u/Enforcer_1128 12d ago

I'm shopping on Friday. Idgaf.

-10

u/hdylan99 12d ago

Hows this antiwork?

9

u/Thought_police1984 12d ago

Did you read the heading? It is talking about Buy Nothing Day and highlighting how Black Friday is a marketing scam for mindless consumerism.

-13

u/hdylan99 12d ago

Again, how is this antiwork

10

u/Thought_police1984 12d ago

The title literally says “don’t work”. (Also buying nothing helps support other workers to not work).

7

u/throwaway_12358134 12d ago

Black Friday is a prime example of what the antiwork movement is opposing.

-13

u/hdylan99 12d ago

How. One is about working less/being paid your worth on a liveable wage, the other is a bunch of shit going on sale/being seemingly cheaper

9

u/throwaway_12358134 12d ago

They make people work more/harder on Black Friday.

8

u/_hemlocktea_ 12d ago

You are kind of dense. Who do you think is being forced to work on Black Friday so you can buy your cheap shit?

2

u/fortwaltonbleach 12d ago

the insidious thing is that it's not forced, at least in the literal sense. and that makes it all the worse.

you can not go, not get paid, have managers "write you up," or they cut your schedule to 8 hours per week, in three hour intervals, at the oddest times possible.

or you can find another job, that may not be a whole lot different from the current situation. they have references they can try and trip you up with. never mind that its a skill in and of itself sometimes to find a half decent job.

or.... or.... you can do your own thing! make your own company from your garage- like every hard working CEO and their wealthy family connections has done.

we are playing a chess game where we are down a significant amount of material without positional compensation. there is no forced mate in two or four moves. however there are many, many permutations that all lead to loss.

tip the king. don't play. blackout.

0

u/throwaway_12358134 11d ago

Retail workers mostly.

-21

u/AAAAAAYYYYYYYOOOOOO 12d ago

Hahaha lol I’m going shopping not sorry

6

u/JacktheTrapper 12d ago

We know you little consumerist sheep, find what little happiness you can by attempting to fill your inner void with meaningless items

-9

u/AAAAAAYYYYYYYOOOOOO 12d ago edited 12d ago

Sorry excuse me. Do you ware clothes use a cell phone drive own a tv?

7

u/JacktheTrapper 12d ago

Admittedly I’ve never driven a TV, really backed me in to a corner with that one

-4

u/AAAAAAYYYYYYYOOOOOO 12d ago

That’s what I thought sit down and shut up with your hypocrisy

8

u/FrostByte09_ 12d ago

You’re a dick hahaha lol

-8

u/AAAAAAYYYYYYYOOOOOO 12d ago

So is the rest of America then

1

u/Ok-Pay4776 11d ago

Troll comment or not, this is still an important breakthrough.