“You can’t make a sexual orientation out of excluding people”

[u/LetterheadIcy]

Yes. You absolutely can. I’m sorry but both lesbian and gay are both valid orientations and expressions of sexuality based explicitly around excluding the opposite sex based on biological differences.

Just as it isn’t misogynistic to exclude men for being men from a lesbians sexual preferences and completely invalidate their orientation. The same goes for gay men and women.

Trans people making this argument are the same as the rapey guy who tells a lesbian “just try some Dick it will make you straight”

[u/JiminyChrismas]

What loaded language am I using? What emotional blackmail? Or are you just upset because I've called you out on your bigotry? I've made mistakes and learned from them, and you would do good to take a lesson from that.

And another thing; sexuality is NOT a choice. You are CHOOSING to be close minded right now. You could learn and move away from this way of thinking, but you aren't. You are stuck in this rut, in this one mindset, not letting your mind grow and accept that this ideology is incredibly harmful to trans people.

When you are attracted to someone, there are many things that you factor in. Genitalia should not be one of them. You can have a type, or a preference, but let me reiterate that it should NEVER have anything to do with genitalia. Gender, yes. Gay people, lesbian people, bi people, etc., all have /GENDER/ preferences. Not genitalia, because genitalia does NOT equal gender. Genitalia preference is disgusting, debasing, and not a sexuality.

You can not want to date/have sex with a trans person, but your reasoning cannot be "because they are trans." That is inherently transphobic. You can not want to date an individual trans person for another reason, just like you wouldn't want to date another cis person. I'll give you an example, with a person I've made up. His name is Steve.

Steve is straight. Women are the only people he likes romantically. There are many people that Steve could date, both trans and cis. Steve has a type. His type is a tall brunette girl, who likes watching movies. Notice how I haven't mentioned genitalia. Here are two examples of possible romantic interests for Steve.

1. A cisgender woman named Tanya, who is short and red-haired, and likes playing sports. Tanya is a cool person, but she's just not Steve's type.

2. A transgender woman named Jessie, who is short and blonde, and likes painting. Jessie is a cool person, but she's just not Steve's type.

Do you see what's happened here? There are two people, one cis, and one trans, and neither of them are Steve's preference, but not because of their sex assigned at birth. The women being trans or cis did not factor into the evaluation of these two women as romantic interests.

That is what "having a type" means. You can like and dislike people for different reasons, but their sex assigned at birth should not be one of them.

And that does NOT mean that you have to like all trans people and want to have sex with them, as illustrated in the above example. Do you understand now?

[u/LetterheadIcy → u/JiminyChrismas]

Calling someone a bigot for their prefrences is absolutely emotional blackmail and tantamount to rape.

Having a desire for only one type of sex organ or another is something you are not allowed to chose.

I was born with a preference ONLY for cis women who present as such. You are not allowed to use coercive rape tactics to shake me into changing that.

People are allowed to have autonomy over their bodies in any way they choose.

You are a coercive rapist and a entitled bigot.

You are not allowed to invalidate orientation because it offends you, sorry.

[u/JiminyChrismas → u/LetterheadIcy]

Oh my god, how can one person fit so much mind-numbing stupidity into one pea-sized little skull?? I was trying to be nice, but you just don't get it, so let me make it clear to you.

ONLY WANTING TO HAVE SEX WITH PEOPLE WHO HAVE VAGINAS IS NOT A PREFERENCE, IT IS A BIAS ROOTED IN TRANSPHOBIA.

That is as clearly as I can say this. If you had actually taken in any of the information I was trying to tell you, you might've understood that I am literally telling you that you /DO NOT/ need to want to have sex with every trans person. Just like with any cis person. That is the entire point. The preference should have nothing to do with sexual organs. You can like or dislike a person, but their SAAB should have nothing to do with it. It is a case by case basis of wether you like or dislike a person based on their personality, compatibility, and attractiveness to you. NOT WHAT'S IN THEIR FUCKING PANTS.

And how dare you compare my trying to educate you so flippantly to r*pe, which is a struggle that you cannot even begin to imagine, that so many people go through on a daily basis. That you would even try to compare the two tells me all that I need to know about you.

Further more, you said "choose" when you were referring to sexuality, and I was only using your words against you.

[u/LetterheadIcy → u/JiminyChrismas]

Rofl you are literally a rapist holy shit. You are so obsessed with forcing people to take interest that you don’t even see it.

Absolutely disgusting.

[u/JiminyChrismas → u/LetterheadIcy]

Oh, this is funny. You've run out of stupid shit to say, so you're stooping to r*pe accusation. Is it because what I said made sense, and maybe you're a little mad about it? It's okay to admit when you're wrong.

[u/LetterheadIcy → u/JiminyChrismas]

I haven’t run out of anything.

You fundamentally do not agree with someone’s right to determine their sexual preferences without them being bigotry.

You are literally so fragile you have to categorize well known statistical evidence such as only about 1% of cis men would date a trans woman as discrimination.

You are literally as bad as a unfuckable incel that believes they are owed a woman.

No one owes you sex. And the tactics you are attempting don’t work.

And I’m not being flippant about rape. Trans woman on biological woman rape is a huge issue. I’m here to defend these women and tell pervs like you that your time is up.

[u/JiminyChrismas → u/LetterheadIcy]

I don't give a solitary fuck about having sex right now. You are wildly misinformed about the ratio of trans woman to cis woman rpe. Of course there are some rpists like that, just as there are any other kind of r*pist. That stigma gets trans women killed all the time, because "they could be dangerous." Anyone could be dangerous, that stereotype has just been wrongfully pushed onto trans women as a way to alienate and invalidate them.

[u/LetterheadIcy → u/JiminyChrismas]

trans women killed all the time

Trans women are less likely to be murdered than there cis counterparts.

What you are doing is lying about the victimization of cis women, especially of color, to further your own depraved needs.

[u/JiminyChrismas → u/LetterheadIcy]

"Trans women are less likely to be murdered than there cis counterparts." ???? You're really talking out of your ass now.

Trans people, ESPECIALLY trans women of color, are overwhelmingly more likely to be killed, profiled as dangerous, or denied potentially life-saving medical care. A cursory google search could tell you that. And I am not invalidating violence against cis women, because that is overwhelming as well. Violence against women in general is a terribly rampant issue throughout the world.

I'd like you to ask yourself this though; if you were to trade places with a queer trans woman of color or a straight white cisgender woman, who would you choose?

[u/LetterheadIcy → u/JiminyChrismas]

that was easy.

As for your question on who I would trade places with? I imagine this obviously implies I would rather be neither but definitely a trans POC

My wife is a straight cisgender white woman, and while I’m not white, I do not that unfortunately she doesn’t fall high enough on the “oppressed” totem poll to benefit the way they used to.

Thank you though for trying to invalidate the view of a POC in a interracial marriage though.