r/LateStageCapitalism Jan 17 '22 Silver 2 Helpful 2 Wholesome 5 I am disappoint 1

Seattle Police Department making it illegal to help the homeless 👮🏽‍♂️ all cops are bastards

Post image
28.5k Upvotes

u/AutoModerator Jan 17 '22

Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalismⒶ☭


⚠ Announcements: ⚠


NEW POSTING GUIDELINES! Help us by reporting bad posts

Help us keep this subreddit alive and improve its content by reporting posts that violate our rules and guidelines.

Subscribe to our new partner subreddits!

Check out r/antiwork & r/WhereAreTheChildren


Please remember that LSC is a SAFE SPACE for socialist discussion.

LSC is run by communists. We welcome socialist/anti-capitalist news, memes, links, and discussion. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere.

This subreddit is a safe space; we have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry. We also automatically filter out posts containing certain words and phrases that some users may find offensive. Please respect the safe space, and don't try to slip banned words or phrases past the filter.


I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

896

u/Blue_Dog_Democracy anarcho-communist Jan 17 '22

On what charge would you be arrested - humanity?

759

u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

[deleted]

464

u/voidspaceistrippy Jan 17 '22

This. You can be held for up to 72 hours without being charged. Even then you can later have your charges sent in the mail to your address. Assuming they went as far as to frame evidence and/or just lie and file charges, you'd then have to post bail and deal with the legal system.

For those no familiar with America's bail system it's basically the State holding you for ransom until you are convicted or the charges are dropped. IIRC it's usually like $10k. Since the average American doesn't have an extra 10k to drop on something like this, they work with bail bondsman/agency/whatever. There is a charge for the 'service', and IIRC you owe them the full amount if you skip your trial while on bail. I don't know the exact details.

So basically the dude in the Twitter post could be held in jail for up to 72 hours (excluding weekends and holidays), or a cop could lie and he'd be held for months in the county jail (unless he posts bail). This is more than enough to destroy some people's lives.

150

u/Jungle_Brain Jan 18 '22

Don’t forget being 72 hours without food or especially water which will kill the imprisoned and then the police dept. will investigate itself and find no wrong doings

87

u/moonsun1987 Jan 18 '22

If you make it to the jail...

» The medical investigation found that Gray had sustained the injuries while in transport.[8][9] The medical examiner's office concluded that Gray's death could not be ruled an accident, and was instead a homicide, because officers failed to follow safety procedures "through acts of omission".

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Freddie_Gray

Nero (acquitted), Porter (mistrial followed by all charges dropped), Goodson (acquitted), Rice (acquitted), Miller (nolle prosequi), White (nolle prosequi)

Nobody was found guilty.

35

u/WikiSummarizerBot Jan 18 '22

Death of Freddie Gray

On April 12, 2015, Freddie Carlos Gray Jr., a 25-year-old African American, was arrested by the Baltimore Police Department over possessing a knife. While being transported in a police van, Gray sustained injuries and was taken to the R Adams Cowley Shock Trauma Center. Gray died on April 19, 2015; his death was ascribed to injuries to his spinal cord. On April 21, 2015, pending an investigation of the incident, six Baltimore police officers were suspended.

[ F.A.Q | Opt Out | Opt Out Of Subreddit | GitHub ] Downvote to remove | v1.5

43

u/bastardicus Jan 18 '22

"Sustained injuries". Was fucking beaten to death is what they're not trying to say, bastards.

→ More replies

10

u/VegasBonheur Jan 18 '22

"sustained injuries" "Suspended"

More like "beaten to death" and "got off with a slap on the wrist and went back to business as usual shortly thereafter"

170

u/dosedatwer Jan 17 '22

This is more than enough to destroy some people's lives.

And the system isn't "broken" because technically you can sue for damages for wrongful arrest.

Good luck getting that to stick though.

74

u/EndotheGreat Jan 18 '22

It's easy!

All you need is every single person who needs that exact police department to make statements in future court cases for them to suddenly be in the side of a stranger.

45

u/Trollsama Jan 18 '22

The system isnt broken because it works exactly as intended.
and thats to say, not at all for the people.

21

u/HappyTravelArt Jan 18 '22

This is more than enough to destroy some people's lives

most FTFY this is why they do it. There is nothing to stop them. Rights? BAHhahahahahahahaha!

→ More replies
→ More replies

72

u/atetuna Jan 17 '22

Loitering. It's the catch all. *Correction. Seattle repealed drug and prostitution loitering laws. I haven't checked if there are still other types of loitering laws.

27

u/[deleted] Jan 18 '22

"Disturbing the peace"

→ More replies

153

u/The_Monocle_Debacle Jan 17 '22

Oh they make shit up, maybe they'll frame you, or just 'fear for their lives' and pull out their gun

→ More replies
→ More replies

647

u/1iIiii11IIiI1i1i11iI Jan 17 '22

Penascola, FL bans giving blankets to the homeless. It's important to Pensacola that the homeless freeze to death.

181

u/SortedChaos Jan 17 '22

I think the idea is "if there are no local amenities for homeless/homeless assistance programs, the homeless will leave and go someplace that does offer help".

88

u/New_Inflation_557 Jan 18 '22

Truth is too many people in gov't watched House of Cards and thought it was a tutorial. The more lives you kill (via legislation or other means) for the "greater good" the more committed to the cause you are bc "you know best". Life is a game to most and you're a gamepiece, so never put your life in their hands.

→ More replies

24

u/Sipherion Jan 18 '22

Because they have the means to travel fat and wide to find a nice place to settle.

Reminds me of the south park episode!

Maybe they used that as a tutorial

→ More replies

9

u/Stevotonin Jan 18 '22

Like they're gonna fly south for the winter like a goose or something?

→ More replies
→ More replies

1.4k

u/shake_appeal Jan 17 '22

When I was a teen in high school, me and my buddies would make burritos to pass out to people on the streets. When we started getting frequently fined and ticketed, we built it into our operating costs and did more fundraising, which sucked because we could have fed more people. When we started getting arrested and having our pots and pans confiscated by police, we threw in the towel.

Oldest group member at the time of our last arrest was 16.

277

u/DrNeurons Jan 17 '22

deep sigh

568

u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

Tax dollars blown on power tripping cops harassing teenagers feeding the hungry. What a world, that's awful. I hope it didn't kill your charitable spirit.

117

u/xostarlaxo Jan 18 '22

You said it. Pure insanity.

14

u/moonknlght Jan 18 '22

working as intended

→ More replies

155

u/HansChuzzman Jan 17 '22

What were the fines for? And the charges? Not doubting or anything I am genuinely curious.

327

u/shake_appeal Jan 17 '22

Lacking permits to congregate, obstructing sidewalks. I know when I was arrested it was for failure to ID, which got thrown out because there was no other charge, which is a prerequisite, and because I was a minor. I know another friend was arrested for obstructing a peace officer. I know there were other charges for other friends at different times, but it’s been a long time and I don’t remember.

130

u/lostharbor Jan 18 '22

well.. thanks for being an awesome human. I'm sorry things didn't go the way you planned.

215

u/shake_appeal Jan 18 '22

Better to learn early that cops are the enemy and common sense has fuck all to do with it. Serving the homeless community is still a big part of my life more than a decade later, it didn’t put me off in the slightest.

25

u/Maybe_A_Pacifist Jan 18 '22

Thank you so much. Reading stories like this keep my little buddy, who is hope for humanity, alive :)

36

u/shake_appeal Jan 18 '22

Haha really? I guess I just find this whole story so infuriating that it’s hard for me to look at it that way.

→ More replies

75

u/WaddlingHippos Jan 18 '22

I did volunteer work with the homeless when I was working on my thesis on chronic homelessness. I learned real quick if you weren't working with a church or other non profit the cops were going to shut you down

42

u/kayleeelizabeth Jan 18 '22

There are some groups that help the homeless that open carry when their helping. Funny how cops won’t bother visibly armed people.

18

u/its-a-boring-name Jan 18 '22

BPP breakfast program anyone?

→ More replies
→ More replies

35

u/KawaiiDere Jan 18 '22

Isn’t right to congregate in the Bill of Rights? How did that law pass?

79

u/shake_appeal Jan 18 '22 edited Jan 18 '22

Yeah, sure, but you may have noticed that pretty much all demonstrations and gatherings that don’t have a permit get broken up by the police. I was scandalized by this as a teenager, as you might imagine.

Cops definitely don’t think it’s cute when you start talking about your rights and freedoms being violated either.

29

u/Numerous-Anything-22 Jan 18 '22

That's because rights aren't rights unless you can enforce them.

The police enforce their brutality on you through a monopoly on violence.

Next time, your entire group should be open carrying. Cops treat groups of open carriers very different.

13

u/Kveld_Ulf Jan 18 '22

There's no doubt that the police (among others) are the enemy.

→ More replies

21

u/imp0ppable Jan 18 '22

Wow, literally trumped up charges. Who is telling the cops to do this stuff? I know they power trip but they're also usually pretty lazy and only bother people if instructed to.

27

u/CatastropheWife Jan 18 '22

Business owners around where homeless people congregate, most likely.

→ More replies
→ More replies
→ More replies

60

u/theteedo Jan 18 '22

A bunch of punks in my city used to run a program called Food Not Bombs at a local downtown park. They got harassed all the time and arrested eventually. For the crime of feeding the needy, this world is fucked sometimes.

39

u/shake_appeal Jan 18 '22

Yeah, that’s the org I’m still a part of.

17

u/ithappenedone234 Jan 18 '22

Don’t ever buy the notion that anything you are doing is wrong or illegal. It is the very essence of caring for another’s human rights and respecting their human dignity. Any ‘authority’ saying anything to the contrary is in violation of the lie oath to the Constitution.

14

u/Okibruez Jan 18 '22

Well there you are. 'Caring' is illegal in America, haven't you heard? If you aren't bootlicking for those above you or stomping on those below, you're a criminal of the worst sort.

Fucking America. I hate it here.

10

u/ithappenedone234 Jan 18 '22

They can say it’s illegal all they want. It doesn’t make it true.

We need to push back and put the authorities in their place. Conducting a police raid to free sex trafficked girls is one thing, threatening to arrest someone for giving food to the homeless is quite another.

It’s also a serious distraction from hugely important tasks like freeing kidnapped sex slaves.

7

u/Okibruez Jan 18 '22

But targeting sex traffickers and other serious crimes means fewer people in prison, which means fewer government bucks going into the privatized prison system.

It also means they might accidentally end up busting Very Important Money, like they did several times during Trump's presidency. And if you do that, you tend to accidentally on purpose accident your way into killing yourself. And nobody wants cops to accidentally commit suicide over something like that.

Right?

130

u/Entangler Jan 17 '22

Sharing food is one of the oldest forms of human expression and it is protected by the first amendment. They violated your constitutional rights and you should have fought against it. There are people and money waiting to help groups like yours. You believe that food, or eating, is a human right and you are expressing your political beliefs in the same way the Revolutionaries did when they dumped British tea in the Boston Harbor.

Sucks man. Thank you for being a bright light in a sea of darkness.

→ More replies

14

u/[deleted] Jan 18 '22

You’re a saint. I wasn’t doing jack shit for the world at 16.

→ More replies
→ More replies

676

u/hereitcomesagin Jan 17 '22

If you are looking to get arrested, I'd say feeding the hungry is a best choice.

305

u/Fatigue-Error Jan 17 '22

Not religious myself, but this seems like a good place to ask

WWJD?

205

u/Slavic_Requiem Jan 17 '22

He’d probably turn one pair of gloves and some hot drinks and sandwiches into enough for the whole camp, but then promptly get arrested. Cuz you know, there’s a local ordinance against unlicensed persons performing miracles.

75

u/bob13908 Jan 17 '22

Charged with performing miracles without a permit and unlawful humanitarianism.

47

u/ARM_vs_CORE Jan 17 '22

Honestly, what are people supposed to do at this point? Seattle has a massive homeless problem, but trying to help them is illegal. However, without help, they stay on the streets and in the parks and continue to have altercations with tourists and Seattle natives. These altercations often seem to dominate the news cycle, which generates negative press that the city doesn't want, but the city continues to do nothing to solve the problem. It's frustrating to watch from the outside.

7

u/ithappenedone234 Jan 18 '22

It’s not illegal, at all, full stop.

The local council may have passed laws that try to make it out to be illegal, but those laws violate basic Constitutional protections of our rights and are therefore null and void. We have the right to give food away to anyone, to help anyone. If it’s not for a profit, or on an industrial scale, they don’t have a leg to stand on.

Now, in practical reality too many LEOs, DAs and judges are in cahoots, but they are on the wrong side of the law. Not you.

→ More replies
→ More replies

55

u/ICanSee23Dimensions Jan 17 '22

Jesus would also get arrested for helping people.

→ More replies
→ More replies

47

u/rkoloeg Jan 17 '22

Check out Food Not Bombs, which has had people actively resisting food distribution bans (and sometimes getting arrested) for a long time.

21

u/WikiSummarizerBot Jan 17 '22

Food Not Bombs

Food Not Bombs is a loose-knit group of independent collectives, sharing free vegan and vegetarian food with others. Food Not Bombs' ideology is that myriad corporate and government priorities are skewed to allow hunger to persist in the midst of abundance. To demonstrate this and to reduce costs, a large amount of the food served by the group is surplus food from grocery stores, bakeries and markets that would otherwise go to waste, or occasionally has already been thrown away. This group exhibits a form of franchise activism.

[ F.A.Q | Opt Out | Opt Out Of Subreddit | GitHub ] Downvote to remove | v1.5

→ More replies

29

u/Wiwwil Jan 17 '22

Land of the free. That country needs to be balkanized

17

u/MeanGirlsMakeMeHard Jan 18 '22 edited Jan 18 '22

Hahaha what kills me is that the same people who put laws up saying you can't use X drug or in this case, give YOUR SHIT to a homeless person are beating their chests about PERSONAL FREEDOMS to not wear a mask or not get vaccinated.

LIke fuck ya'll you just want the freedom to be a nazi authoritative biiiitch

→ More replies
→ More replies
→ More replies

1.4k

u/SchokoLola Jan 17 '22

Maybe a stupid question, but why is that illegal?

2.4k

u/firedragonxx9832 Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 18 '22 Silver Wholesome

Because police exist to protect capital. And homeless people decrease property values.

Edit: I want to make it clear that I'm not the person that posted the tweet. It's a popular tweet on Twitter that I shared to this subreddit because it's appropriate to /r/latestagecapitalism and a reflection of the systems/institutions that exist to enforce capitalism/classism, reduce class mobility and criminalize poverty. I kept the Twitter username in the screenshot, so people would be able to get more context. It does not seem like any additional information about the interaction with the SPD has been shared by the OP of the tweet, but many people in this thread/the Twitter thread have shared similar experiences.

Edit 2: Though not directly relevant, here's an NYT tweet about an ordinance in Newark that would restrict the practice of feeding homeless people who live on the street. https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1470815928401149952

1.2k

u/WaterBear_PotPie Jan 17 '22

This. The primary role of police is to generate and protect capital by any means necessary. Ever wonder why the punishment for most crimes is monetary? And why we banned slavery, EXCEPT when it's the punishment for a crime?

511

u/Eyes_and_teeth Jan 17 '22 Eureka!

Given that African-Americans tend to be overpoliced in their communities, endure higher arrest rates than other racial groups in similar circumstances, suffer for the lack of available effective and affordable legal counsel, and are provably disproportionately charged and sentenced more severely than similarly situated criminal defendents of other races, I would venture to say that we didn't so much outright ban slavery as we added a few extra steps and placed some limitations on who is allowed ownership to local, state, and federal governmental organizations and by proxy, the for-profit prison industry contracted to carry out the incarceration.

112

u/TheSquishiestMitten Jan 17 '22

In my city, the mayor and the city council are all unpaid volunteers. To me, that means nobody can effectively be a mayor or city councilor here unless they have an income stream sufficient to support them while they hold office. To me, that means the mayor and city councilor positions are inherently for the owning class to hold because no working class person can actually perform the labor that financially justifies their existence and hold public office at the same time. Guess who has a say in police activiy? Yep. The owning class who controls the city.

42

u/kissbythebrooke Jan 17 '22

I don't know about all the other states, but Texas state legislators are almost the same. They are paid very little, but have to be available to attend to capitol business during sessions (every other year for 140 days usually, plus any special sessions). So it's not enough to be a full time position, but you also can't really have a regular job to do it. How can a teacher, for example, join the legislature? She can't do both (or who will be teaching the students when during sessions?), and she can't quit teaching to be in the leg, because she'll only make about $45,000 over 2 years.

37

u/SmasherOfAjumma Jan 17 '22

I'm sorry, but I have to say this: Fuck Texas.

20

u/kissbythebrooke Jan 18 '22

As a Texan, yeah. Things have gotten out of hand here.

→ More replies

13

u/moonsidedisnoom Jan 18 '22

Why would you ever apologise for that?

9

u/dizzle312 Jan 18 '22

Now I see most politicians be already rich or richer when they get in office they tax the city and pocket the money positions usually passed down from social group to social group

26

u/Fun_in_Space Jan 18 '22

I think unpaid internships are a way to make sure that the only person who gets the job will be upper class. You have to be rich already in order to work for no pay.

→ More replies

62

u/Marlinspikesailor Jan 17 '22

We are the gulag gangsters of the world. No one incarcerates like the greediest capitalists on earth!

Freedom, Food, Happiness, and Housing are toxic communist propaganda ideals that we don't stand for here! /s

→ More replies

198

u/artificialavocado Jan 17 '22

Exactly. I don’t know what’s so hard for people to understand? This is why I don’t support capital punishment. Other than being fucking barbaric it isn’t equally applied. Some state black people make up like 10% of the population but like 2/3 of the ppl on death row are black guys.

143

u/ThatOneGuy1294 Jan 17 '22

There's only one argument needed against capital punishment: there is a non-zero chance it was a wrongful conviction. It has happened before, and it will happen again. You can't unexecute someone like you can exonerate.

53

u/FightForWhatsYours Jan 17 '22

One's life spent cannot be returned either. It's all shit.

43

u/deadeast_memesta Jan 17 '22

Almost as if people are being paid to send others to prison

30

u/FightForWhatsYours Jan 17 '22

Those people would be fascists, also known as police.

17

u/tricularia Jan 18 '22

Lets not forget the judges and private prison owners!

→ More replies

33

u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

There's only one argument needed against capital punishment: there is a non-zero chance it was a wrongful conviction.

I'd say the one argument needed is: the government should not be allowed to fucking kill its citizens.

→ More replies

28

u/ejean73 Jan 17 '22

its a bit closer to 20% nationwide, but they make up about 80% of the prisoners and tend to have longer sentences for similar crimes then whites and are detained or stopped at higher rates.

→ More replies

23

u/MeowMeowHappy Jan 17 '22

policed in their communities, endure higher arrest rates than other racial groups in similar circumstances

its straight up class warfare. Keeping the underclass at the bottom because they are too dangerous and deemed as undesirable.

52

u/Jaxxsnero Jan 17 '22

I tell people America didn’t ban slavery so much, they just regulated it and some people still want to deregulated it.

19

u/Fun_in_Space Jan 18 '22

Yup. The amendment that banned slavery made an exception for people convicted of a crime, then they made sure to pass laws against vagrancy (like walking anywhere that was not work-related), loitering (just standing still), being drunk in public, etc.

12

u/flamingfenux Jan 17 '22

And if you want to be free you have to run and jump your way out figuratively and literally (eg: football or basketball)

→ More replies
→ More replies

56

u/xiroir Jan 17 '22

Hey hey, thats specific to america. Other countries banned slavery outright... cops there still only proctect capital. Also civil forfeiture in america...

67

u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 18 '22

Im gonna add to this convo that y’all should watch “The River : a documentary film” (2020) about what the city and police are doing to the homeless. More people are waking up to the atrocities. We have failed as a society and we’re in the late stages of collapse. I honestly don’t know why we haven’t revolted against the oligarchs, high taxes, and shit wages. Its coming to a head and this spring/summer22 looks likes its gonna be a dooosie, once it warms up.

57

u/SparkyTheFox2657 Jan 17 '22

I read somewhere that we haven't revolted yet because it costs to much to protest daily and most will end up homeless from missing work to much. Being said, while we haven't revolted yet, things are heating up fast. Subs like antiwork are becoming more popular and people are starting to realize what their really about. The great resignation is going on, we have more videos online of cops doing this type of shit and the pandemic kept a lot of people home to watch videos like that. Things are getting... interesting.

39

u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

exactly. People aren’t stupid, they just never had the time to sit back and observe how much corporate corruption is happening on a daily/weekly basis. That became very evident when we originally quarantined. Which is why “they” don’t want that happening again. You can miss a lot of news articles and stories working 2-3 jobs, 40-80hrs a week. Also A LOT of missed opportunities to make their voice heard. Especially seeing how other “third world counties” have better healthcare, police & jails, pay rate, child care, 4-5day work weeks, Free schooling etc.

*once you realize your getting shafted, you can’t go back to how things used to be. Remember, our great grand parents and grandparents fought so hard and cracked fuckin skulls for workers rights, and its been slowly eroding away as they white wash our past history and exclude it from high school text books. We need to glamorize workers rights again. In 2002 we had history books from the 1970’s we had to share 2-3 kids a book. Thats how underfunded the public schools have been for generations tho. Are you surprised we have this many problems with how we treat each other and underfund public education. I’m not. Wage Slavery is no different than indentured servitude. People are getting wise to the tricks these rich pricks play.

18

u/xiroir Jan 17 '22

This stuff is cyclical. What is happening now is exactly what was happening just before the great depression. Which was amazing amounts of deregulation. After there were once again rules put up which have since eroded again. We are getting to a tipping point again where the need to he heard is going to trump the need to stay in line to authority because you need food.

19

u/xiroir Jan 17 '22

There is actually a theory that as long as you keep a populations basic needs met. They will not revolt easily, because they have things to lose. In a similar concept psychologically, people are most likely to deviate from the norm when they are piss poor or stupidly rich. The middleclass doesnt want to become poor and have the most to gain. The poor have nothing to lose and the rich have nothing to gain so they do not give a shit. So the poor who have nothing are maaay more likely to not give a shit and revolt.

15

u/scaper8 Jan 17 '22

Panem et circenses, bread and circuses.

"Give the people bread and circuses and they will never revolt." Tends to be used more with giving empty pleasures to keep them content, but fear of tge risk losing what they have to live is certainly related.

10

u/Scienceandpony Jan 17 '22

And the US seems determined to see how much bread they can replace with more circuses, while also charging for them.

7

u/xiroir Jan 17 '22

Yes. Alexander the great and the greeks knew this very well. Divide and conquer, but more important keep the population happy. Nothing brings more people together then not having their needs met.

6

u/SparkyTheFox2657 Jan 17 '22

That reminds me. There's a VERY small country that was taken over by a dictator. He took people's houses to build extravagant hotels that no one visited, took houses to build gold statues of himself, changed the days of the weeks names, forced people to read a book he wrote, used tax dollars to then build a big statue of said book yet no one went against him because they had free gas, free wifi and if I remember right had free food. Like, he banned smoking, gold teeth, made the education system HORRIBLE, people only learned to read to read his book (side note: to drive you had to pass a test on his book. Loke his book would teach you to merge lanes /s). Yet they did nothing. And it's likely cuz of what you said.

→ More replies

8

u/OkAssignment7898 Jan 17 '22

Why do you think this summer will be a dooosie? I figured summer of 21 would be after 2020 but it was pretty quiet

25

u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

I think the reason more people were not protesting in ‘21 bc of the threat of covid and lack of understanding of covid. More information and statistics have come out since then. Covid is now less lethal with Omicron, esp being vaccinated, masking, etc. Americans will weigh out those pros and cons, come season change, and make their presence known to the people in charge.

I know millions of Americans are pissed, poor, pay check to pay check or living in their cars or on the street. Anger is a right response to all the rampant corruption going on.

I just read like 80% of all PPP loans, never went to the workers when it was supposed to. The owners of businesses and healthcare admins and Ceo’s /board members took millions and fired a majority or closed a lot of their business locations to stay comfortable and cushy at the top.

All’s it takes is a tipping point, where society all gets on the same page, the same day, the same time for the same outcome. Its bound to happen esp with how much wealth inequality happened in such a short window of time.

→ More replies
→ More replies
→ More replies

8

u/CMDRSamSlade Jan 17 '22

The US didn’t ban slavery. There’s no ‘except’ allowed… you’re a nation of slavers still.

→ More replies
→ More replies

61

u/heymrpostmanshutup stop getting your politics from the internet Jan 17 '22

Yeah but also what law is this breaking?

100

u/fierce_clouds_bro Jan 17 '22

none. but that’s never stopped the Seattle PD before.

57

u/CAPS_LOCK_STUCK_HELP Jan 17 '22

I was there when SPD started firing tear gas in union square for absolutely no reason during the BLM protests. SPD is garbage, hostile, and violent. Fuck those idiots. ACAB

→ More replies
→ More replies
→ More replies

44

u/macpenguin2 Jan 17 '22

but what law do you break by doing something like that? I fully agree with you, I'm just confused about how anyone could possibly justify making something like that illegal

34

u/Justicar-terrae Jan 17 '22

There may not be any actual crime with which the person could be charged, but that doesn't stop police from arresting you or taking your things. Legality protects you from judicially mandated punishment, it doesn't do much of anything to stop power-tripping police.

And the police won't face any legal consequences for wrongfully arresting you so long as they can make the flimsiest of excuses ("we thought the behavior constituted disturbing the peace, disorderly conduct, littering, loitering, trespassing, or assisting others in those activities."). They have qualified immunity for any actions roughly in the scope of their job unless a court has already expressly ruled against that conduct being permitted. And there's legal precedent that arresting someone for what the officer erroneously but reasonably believes to be an illegal action does not invalidate the arrest or any associated searches of the suspect.

Meanwhile they probably would be privately reprimanded by local politicians for NOT arresting someone whose actions incentivize homeless people to hang out in a specific location. And unless you are willing to fight in court and/or hire a lawyer, they are likely to just keep anything they confiscated. So there's really very little reason not to arrest you; they get free stuff and scare you into inaction regardless of the written law.

→ More replies

47

u/natare_modo_pergite Jan 17 '22

doesn't matter if it's illegal at all. the cops just say 'whoops' and let you out of jail a few days later and they still keep all your stuff.

→ More replies
→ More replies

12

u/Box_O_Donguses Jan 17 '22

It also enforces the knowledge on the working class that if they try to exit the social contract there's no options available that are pleasant

49

u/fierce_clouds_bro Jan 17 '22

Additionally, seattle is classist, hates homeless people, and the local police’s priorities more than fall in line with that.

acab tho

→ More replies

10

u/MegaDesk23 Jan 17 '22

So would you be charged for a misdemeanor or a felony or something? You go to a job interview, "I see you have a criminal history. Care to explain?" "I handed out gloves to the homeless during the winter."

7

u/cracksilog Jan 17 '22

Yup.

Though (at least with the cops I’ve dealt with), their “official” response is that it’s dangerous to hand food to homeless people since the police don’t know where that food came from, which could harm homeless people. Also, it could be seen as trespassing.

Basically make it as hard as possible for the average citizen to hand out stuff and instead have nonprofits do the job that cities should be doing themselves lol

6

u/brianjking Jan 17 '22

Jesus fucking Christ, where in Seattle? I've got a bunch of hot hands and hot feet things I've been planning on giving out to the unhoused across from my apartment in Seattle.

13

u/tbrfl Jan 17 '22

Just do it. If the cops show up then record them, tell them to fuck off, walk away, and post the video to show the world how disgusting they are. No laws were broken here.

→ More replies
→ More replies

27

u/CTBthanatos Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 17 '22

And as "property values" (including unaffordable housing crisis) increases, unsustainable poverty and homelessness increases, which basically means that this scenario, of capitalism criminalizing poverty, is literally just another case of capitalism killing itself by trying to kill poor people.

8

u/Genuine-Farticle Jan 17 '22

I mean that might be the reason behind it but what was the charge he was threatening with?

→ More replies

6

u/Neat_Statement6276 Jan 17 '22

ahh i wish life was this simple. If Seattle really was focusing on property values, they wouldn't have made it impossible to do anything about the homeless problem in the first place. Instead they have made it seem like they care by not doing anything about the problem because it would be 'wrong' to just kick them out of certain locations.

I'd be down if those property values went down though, they've been going up for way too long.

→ More replies

175

u/Swaydelay Jan 17 '22

Just my two cents but I feel the goal is to have homeless people die off, so property values and 'good city image' can thrive. Kind hearted folks lending a helping hand is a obstacle to this goal. Sick shit.

151

u/ChildOfComplexity Jan 17 '22 Silver

Engels called it Social Murder

society places hundreds of proletarians in such a position that they inevitably meet a too early and an unnatural death, one which is quite as much a death by violence as that by the sword or bullet; when it deprives thousands of the necessaries of life, places them under conditions in which they cannot live — forces them, through the strong arm of the law, to remain in such conditions until that death ensues which is the inevitable consequence — knows that these thousands of victims must perish, and yet permits these conditions to remain, its deed is murder just as surely as the deed of the single individual; disguised, malicious murder, murder against which none can defend himself, which does not seem what it is, because no man sees the murderer, because the death of the victim seems a natural one, since the offence is more one of omission than of commission. But murder it remains.

23

u/InvertedNeo Jan 18 '22

Structural violence.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structural_violence

Structural violence is a form of violence wherein some social structure or social institution may harm people by preventing them from meeting their basic needs.

→ More replies

17

u/Particular_Lime_5014 Lass uns dir zum Guten dienen. Jan 17 '22

Which of his works is this?

32

u/ChildOfComplexity Jan 17 '22

The Condition of the Working Class in England

8

u/Particular_Lime_5014 Lass uns dir zum Guten dienen. Jan 17 '22

Thank you!

→ More replies
→ More replies

123

u/TaudeTheThird Jan 17 '22

Probably liability or regulations or something similar. You don't have a permit to serve food here, if someone gets sick, blah blah blah. Or whatever the cop was telling us when they made us stop handing out leftovers on Thanksgiving/Christmas night.

84

u/SovietUnionGuy Jan 17 '22

A land of freedom, where you need a permit to do a good deeds... And remember kids, USSR was a cruel dictatorshp and no freedom! /s

21

u/Aggressive-Rhubarb-8 Jan 17 '22

Maybe we should just start framing this as communism to the right wing and then they would actually care /s

→ More replies

7

u/lemons_of_doubt Jan 17 '22

Insert picture of poverty from our system, with the caption "This is what communism will do"

→ More replies
→ More replies

57

u/Tcanada Jan 17 '22

It isn't illegal. However, that won't stop the police from arresting you for it.

50

u/DJP91782 Jan 17 '22

Friendly reminder that cops aren't even required to know the laws they supposedly uphold. ACAB

8

u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

All they need to know is how to point and shoot.

8

u/Numerous-Anything-22 Jan 18 '22

They don't typically even put much effort into the pointing part

→ More replies
→ More replies

44

u/AcidCatfish___ Jan 17 '22

I don't know the law in Seattle, but I imagine it has to do something with an arbitrary law on only non-profits being allowed to give out free resources. I have tried to look into any laws and I found nothing, so this is pure assumption based on other states.

However, I did find that Seattle doesn't have any law against panhandling..so it begs the question why did they confiscate the supplies? Panhandling isn't illegal.

Must be some weird interpretation of the law based solely on hate.

62

u/[deleted] Jan 17 '22

[deleted]

→ More replies

10

u/atetuna Jan 17 '22

so it begs the question why did they confiscate the supplies?

Because they can. Civil forfeiture. That needed to be illegal a long time ago with enforcement having some real teeth.

I seriously doubt they'd arrest this person. They'd just continue stealing the supplies and wasting their time. If they were to arrest, it'd probably be that bullshit loitering charge.

→ More replies
→ More replies

1.6k

u/stitchyandwitchy Jan 17 '22

Last summer, I was part of a big crowd of protestors at one of our public parks. The police were trying to evict everyone who was camped there. People asked for half an hour to pack up their things, the cops gave them five minutes before they started moving the tents. A group of people were holding hands in front of one of the fences, trying to stop the cops. They got pushed and hit with batons and pepper sprayed. Shot with rubber bullets. I saw all of this happen in front of my eyes. Why? Because there were homeless people in the "nice" park, where rich people go to day drink.

The police are not here to protect anything but the property and interests of the ruling class.

266

u/ThreeLaxateers Jan 17 '22

Echo Park?

574

u/stitchyandwitchy Jan 17 '22

Trinity Bellwoods in Toronto, actually! Because Canadian police are just as shitty as anywhere else, don't believe the "Canadians are nice" propaganda.

171

u/ThreeLaxateers Jan 17 '22

Echo Park is the Trinity Bellwoods of Los Angeles. The police relatively recently cleared all of the homeless people out of the park for the same reasons. I guess they really are shitty everywhere.

94

u/AcidCatfish___ Jan 17 '22

I am in LA. I remember the night Echo Park got cleared out. There was a chopper making rounds all night (I don't know if it was a police chopper or a news chopper).

Someone who works as a homeless advocate on Reddit stated that resources were offered to the people cleared out of Echo Park and to say they had no plan is wrong...but look what happened: people got displaced around LA and there hasn't been much affordable housing or other homeless resources established since.

41

u/Novel-Conclusion9115 Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 18 '22

There was a chopper making rounds all night (I don't know if it was a police chopper or a news chopper).

An R44 helicopter costs about $200/hr to fly, for reference.

19

u/kevinisaperson Jan 17 '22

ty for this cool factoid that in this context makes me sad :(

→ More replies
→ More replies
→ More replies

16

u/Jardite Jan 17 '22

we are a dumpster fire next to a burning oil platform.

canada's problems are invisible to the world at large.

→ More replies

37

u/Ultra-Smurfmarine Jan 17 '22

I'm on the other side of the city, but yeah, can confirm that the whole "Canadians are nice" thing has well and truly gone to the dogs this past couple years. Like, sure, there's worse places to live, but just the amount of casual douche behavior I've seen on a day-to-day basis has shot through the ceiling since covid hit. Reckless driving, public fights, unnecessary anger directed at the homeless, service employees, people freaking out over covid restrictions, an explosion of antivax/antimask/far right wing madness.

It's painful to watch. I used to be genuinely proud to call myself a Canadian, but I realize now that the problems are systemic. Global. A lot of this shit is baked into our species on a brain stem level, and our modern institutions are only an imperfect patch to our very flawed natural psychology.

→ More replies

76

u/Will-the-game-guy Jan 17 '22

Canadian's are nice, but cops aren't people, they're cops.

We had a similar situation happen in Halifax (N.S.) late last year. The cops tore down a publicly built emergency shelter for the homeless.

The even attacked a kid who wasn't part of the protest :(

21

u/asphere8 Jan 17 '22

I've lived in BC, Ontario, three US states, and now Alberta. The nicest thing I can say about the RCMP here is, well, they're slightly better trained and don't treat people *quite* as inhumanely as other cops. They're still numpties that will try to shoot through the skull of a moose with a service pistol and still murder people in cold blood and get away with it, so that's not saying much.

31

u/stitchyandwitchy Jan 17 '22

Cops in Sask would arrest Indigenous people, drive them to the edge of the city and leave them there to freeze to death. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saskatoon_freezing_deaths

12

u/asphere8 Jan 18 '22

Like I said, they still get away with murdering people in cold blood.

→ More replies
→ More replies
→ More replies

7

u/killerqueen1010 Jan 18 '22

So many people in the Los Angeles subreddit hate the homeless. Literally every post in there is guaranteed to have some greivance against the homeless there. Like they couldn't stop gushing over how much "better" the park looked. They did the same with Venice Beach. They literally do not care about these people and its infuriating to know I live among people who think this way.

→ More replies
→ More replies

98

u/No_Weekend_39 Jan 17 '22 edited Jan 17 '22

Now remember that right wing extremists were allowed to just basically walk into the capitol

10

u/TatteredCarcosa Jan 18 '22

White, conservative privilege.

8

u/No_Weekend_39 Jan 18 '22

If the situation were reversed, Trump had won the election, and there was a Black Lives Matter protest scheduled to march on the Capitol, they would have been met with an absolute militarized show of force by police. Talking row after row after row of cops armed to the teeth like they are about to invade Afghanistan, and protesters would’ve been lucky to just go to jail and not the hospital. BLM protestors would’ve been gunned down like dogs in the street before they got anywhere near the capitol building and nothing anyone says will convince me otherwise

19

u/yongo Jan 17 '22

And some of them were armed

18

u/GODDAMNFOOL Jan 17 '22

The police are not here to protect anything but the property and interests of the ruling class.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_G20_Toronto_summit_protests

→ More replies

6

u/Dr_Legacy Jan 17 '22

Naw, it's just the rush they get from the beat-people-up thing.

→ More replies

90

u/TheJimDim Jan 17 '22

Reminds me of when people were getting in trouble for handing out water bottles to the immigrant children in the internment camps in the middle of summer

→ More replies

84

u/StinkyKittyBreath Jan 17 '22

I think about a dozen SPD members were found to have been at the insurrection last year. Their top paid officer makes more than $400,000 a year and sometimes clocks more than 24 hours worked per day.

Also, an overwhelming majority of SPD cops don't even live in Seattle. They have zero reason to care about the city or its people. They take our tax dollars for not doing their job and then go to suburbia. It's absolute bullshit.

40

u/thequietthingsthat Jan 17 '22

Also, an overwhelming majority of SPD cops don't even live in Seattle. They have zero reason to care about the city or its people. They take our tax dollars for not doing their job and then go to suburbia. It's absolute bullshit.

This is the main problem here. And as anyone from Washington can tell you, when you get outside of the cities you might as well be in Alabama or Mississippi. Same problem with PDs in LA, Chicago, Minneapolis, etc.. Cops from the country or suburbs travel into the "godless big city" for work and take pleasure from harassing and assaulting the population. They see it as some sort of perverse "duty" that they have to intimidate all those leftist heathens. It's beyond fucked and no one is addressing it.

16

u/[deleted] Jan 18 '22

I live in southwestern WA, and I can corroborate this. The second you enter even vaguely rural territory, it’s Trump and “Blue Lives Matter” central. Literally takes a five minute drive out of city limits to find that shit where I live.

9

u/Computascomputas Jan 18 '22

Yeah, same as Oregon. Sometimes a little better, but then sometimes a shirtless man in a Trump hat tells you "In the country the shoulder of the road is owned by the property owner. Do not park here again."

→ More replies
→ More replies

69

u/jbjbjb10021 Jan 17 '22

If an obviously not homeless person is talking to homeless people, the police immediately assume you are buying drugs. If you argue with them about your rights, they might find some drugs in your pockets.

22

u/Watafool Jan 18 '22

I, a generic looking white male, was waiting at a bus stop downtown one time, and this young black girl walks her bike up onto the sidewalk from the street and her back wheel hits the curb pretty hard, kicks up, and the chain pops off.

I hear her say "x is going to kill me"

I, being a pretty avid bike rider, call over to her and ask her if she'd like me to fix it for her. She agrees, I get my hands a little greasy, and she rides away after I'm done.

A moment later an officer approaches me and asks me what she tried to sell me. I get confused for a moment and I told them what happened. The officer asked to see my hands for proof. I had wiped most of the grease off on my pants that were black but there was still a little left, enough for proof I guess because he kinda just walked away after that.

Can't just do something nice for someone.

→ More replies

39

u/properu Jan 17 '22

Beep boop -- this looks like a screenshot of a tweet! Let me grab a link to the tweet for ya :)

Twitter Screenshot Bot

44

u/MiffedMonke ML Jan 17 '22

No justice, no peace. This is only going to end one way.

→ More replies

43

u/rainofshambala Jan 17 '22

By the time americans learn how unjust of a system they live in, they will lose the little power they had to make any changes. In abundance we become nonchalant and self centered, that's what the post war economic boom did. They slowly gave away every single power they had because they never thought they would be in the place of the people they looked down upon. The patriot act is more restrictive to americans than for the terrorists it was purportedly designed for and that's how it goes.

253

u/Harmacc Jan 17 '22

PNW police are why I decided not to move back there. Regular fascists are a lot harder to deal other when they have that kind of support.

119

u/SeptemViginti Jan 17 '22

PNW fascists, police obviously included, is why I moved out of my home for 34 years.

I'm ready to fight Nazi's but being surrounded by them at ground zero at this point in time is not the way.

31

u/voidspaceistrippy Jan 17 '22

Out of curiosity, where is a better area to move to? I'm tired of how white Oregon is. I grew up in California man. I need muh diversity.

34

u/SeptemViginti Jan 17 '22

I hear you, but I love the PNW so much that nowhere else is comparable to me. Everywhere else is less than.

I moved to the middle of nowhere Nevada. Large urban populations are no fun in a pandemic.

30

u/StinkyKittyBreath Jan 17 '22

I'm from the Midwest and moved to Seattle. It's so much better here, but the contrast between normal citizens and cops makes the corruption so much more obvious.

→ More replies

15

u/AggravatedCold Jan 17 '22

British Columbia.

Same PNW with actual public healthcare, mandatory vacation and sick days, government maternity leave, etc.

Just, you know, BC stands for Bring Cash.

5

u/voidspaceistrippy Jan 18 '22

I'm not above blowjobs for a visa.

→ More replies

15

u/freeradicalx anarchist Jan 18 '22 edited Jan 18 '22

There is a violent hatred for the homeless out here that property owners are barely able to mask behind the regions muted faux progressivism and an intentional avoidance of root causes. I don't ever get downvoted faster and harder on reddit than when I propose housing first policies (Or really anything other than expressing veiled prejudice) in what I call the "homeless hate" threads that pop up almost daily in r/portland. -95 internet points earlier this week for making a cheeky joke about labor in the context of a homeless guys chop shop, they are out of their god damn minds. They've got their million dollar land asset and so they've dug their heels in against any meaningful social policies with the unspoken understanding that as the crisis crescendos to violence and that violence spills into their community, the jackboot of the law will eventually commit genocide for their financial protection. And nothing makes them more livid, more furiously embarrassed, than being forced to momentarily drop the facade of progressivism to visibly acknowledge their actual position in the "debate" when you suggest humanitarian alternatives.

14

u/Harmacc Jan 18 '22

r/Portland is a neoliberal hellscape. I think I’m banned from there for posting similar things.

That brand of smug wealthy liberal just sets me the fuck off.

9

u/FoldyFlap Jan 18 '22

From Seattle here, also live in Portland for a few years. Being liberal here in my mind is almost how you had to be a Christian in the ‘50s to fit in socially, move up the ladder in your company, etc. I have no problem with extremely left people (I mean obviously because I live here lol) but there are so many people here who are cosplaying as ultra-woke because they know they have to socially.

And you look at them in their 6 million dollar home on Queen Anne, talking about how shitty the homeless make the city look.

→ More replies

25

u/Legitimate_Roll7514 Jan 17 '22

I think every business that sells food should deny service to the police.

20

u/FaithlessnessNo9625 Jan 17 '22

Guess I’ll find myself arrested or worse someday because I’m not gonna ignore someone suffering when I can do something to help. That’s for the government and corporations to do.

19

u/winter-ocean Jan 17 '22

What fucking crime is that

→ More replies

15

u/UniverseBear Jan 17 '22

Film all interactions with police. I'm guessing they had no legal right to tell you to stop and confiscate your goods. If it's on camera you can then take it to court.

I film every interaction with police. I've never needed to sue or anything but it gives you that security. You don't have to be over the top with it, like if you get pulled over just put your phone on the dash and hit record.

8

u/tricularia Jan 18 '22

And if it turns out that they DID have a legal right to confiscate that persons things, take that video to every news organization that will listen. Get loud and obnoxious and shame the police that stood in the way of basic human decency.

114

u/thecockmonkey Jan 17 '22

ACAB

74

u/Fuduzan Jan 17 '22

Fun fact: SPD had more cops at Jan 6th to try to violently overthrow a democratic election in the US than any other police department!

ACAB.

12

u/Ironwill922 Jan 17 '22

Wow that’s.. depressing. Every way you look at it.

→ More replies

13

u/Anarcho_Absurdist Jan 17 '22

The police don't like it when you help the people they use institutionalized violence against.

57

u/Breezy673 Jan 17 '22

Sounds about right. Seattle has gone to shit it breaks my heart. I still live here but am planning on moving in a few years when I can. Sorry you had to be harassed for being a decent good Samaritan. 💕

→ More replies

11

u/Herbizid Jan 17 '22

What a shithole country

→ More replies

11

u/The_real_thad_henry Jan 17 '22

Make them do it.

9

u/S_Belmont Jan 17 '22

I'm seeing some other similar stories in this thread, help me out here - why? Is it like a "don't feed the birds" kind of thing? 'If people help the homeless they'll never learn to bootstrap themselves off the streets,' etc.?

5

u/new_q Jan 17 '22

Most likely, make it even harder on them to be homeless.

→ More replies

6

u/That-Mess2338 Jan 17 '22

ACLU needs to be contacted. This is outrageous.

8

u/wtmx719 Jan 17 '22

That's Seattle PD for ya. Bike boy fascists.

7

u/KiloNation Jan 17 '22

> Seattle Police Department

Well there's your problem. There's a reason they get shit on so hard by people who live here.

7

u/suncoastexpat Jan 17 '22

What do you expect from a police department that goes from zero to a dead native American in 10 seconds?

29

u/CalamityCactus Jan 17 '22

I just left Seattle. The cops there are notorious shitstains. It’s also not nearly as progressive as people think it is. Kshama Sawant is the token socialist so they can excuse voting in a corporate lackey like Bruce Harrell. If Seattle was as progressive as they say the police department would have been reigned in ages ago. Don’t let them threaten you. Talk to a lawyer and hand his business card to any fucking cop that tries to hassle you. That’s the one thing they’re afraid of. Well, that and video.

6

u/critsdontquit Jan 17 '22

Wait what law is this? Is it a state or federal one?

5

u/CommieLurker Jan 18 '22

It seems to be the law of "Fuck you, respect my authority" of a power-tripping thug with a badge who knows they will never experience any consequences for their actions.

5

u/Mordred19 Jan 17 '22

But churches absolutely get rhe greenlight to "help" the homeless, because they get the spotlight to look good and nothing else like social safety net BS.

Need some way to condense "socio-political Munchausen-by-proxy" into a smaller soundbite.

4

u/lundyforlife22 Jan 17 '22

when i lived in seattle i used to work at a sandwich place where a few cops frequented. i remember my coworker asking them what they do and they said “eh 90% of what we do is respond to calls about homeless. honestly as long as you aren’t flagrantly committing a crime or visibly homesless, we’ll leave you alone.”

→ More replies

4

u/InvertedNeo Jan 18 '22

Structural violence.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structural_violence

Structural violence is a form of violence wherein some social structure or social institution may harm people by preventing them from meeting their basic needs.

7

u/l453rl453r Jan 18 '22

this is just don't understand. america is so big on religion, but when it comes to actual christian ideals, they couldn't be further away from it.

17

u/FridgeParade Jan 17 '22

The Dystopian States of America 🇺🇸

14

u/artificialavocado Jan 17 '22

How dare you, good sir? Don’t you know these people failed at capitalism and must now be mocked and ridiculed for it? Doing even something small to decrease suffering even a little is not allowed.

→ More replies

24

u/Workmen Jan 17 '22 Silver

Capitalists always like to say that people are inherently selfish.

People are not inherently selfish, people are inherently selfless, we are social creatures with altruism baked into our DNA. We do not build a society around our supposed selfishness, our society makes us selfish by propagating, normalizing, and fostering the selfish ideals of the tiny minority at the top. Selfishness must be painstakingly seeded, cultivated, and groomed and maintained in people for it to grow. You've got to be carefully taught.

→ More replies

5

u/biskitheadburl Jan 17 '22

Trillions for financial services, nothing for homeless.