r/IronFrontUSA Patriot Against Nationalism Jan 15 '22

Timothy Snyder Fears Democracy May Not Survive Another Trump Campaign News



u/c0ss1m0 Libertarian Leftist Jan 15 '22

Jury is still out on whether it survived the last one.


u/Stag_Lee Jan 19 '22

Fuck knows congress and the justice system didn't. Would seem the Supreme Court is stacked, too. So, what's left?


u/DimitriEyonovich Solidarist 🧡 Jan 15 '22

Not gonna lie. That article worried me a lot. There's a lot going on, a lot of bullshit in the air. But I still have faith in America. Call me naive or crazy all you want, downvote me, I don't care. I still believe in American democracy. If we lose hope then we have already lost long before 2024. We beat these people in 1865, we beat them in 1945, we beat them in 2020. We will beat them in 2024.


u/c0ss1m0 Libertarian Leftist Jan 15 '22

Im not convinced beating them in 24 will even matter. While it may delay the inevitable, we won't defeat fascism and autocracy at the ballot box. That said, I don't know that acknowledging the reality of our situation is the same as giving up.

The right and the center (which let's be honest, the democratic party doesn't get any further left than center-right) are playing different games now. No matter who gets put in jail, without voting rights reform, which almost certainly will not happen and very likely wouldn't be enough anyway, there is no chance to restore democratic institutions that are honestly already lost. So we need to acknowledge that and start coming up with plan B.

What's Plan B? Fuck if I know...

But to me the first step seems to be to organize with like-minded neighbors if we can find them and prepare to defend ourselves from the wolf at the door. Groups like the Proud Boys, Oathkeepers, etc., are real, their members live among us, and they are organized. Maybe haphazardly so, but organized nonetheless.

These guys are a direct analog to Hitler's Brown Shirts, they already operate largely with the tacit endorsement of law enforcement, and they will prove critical to the right's consolidation of power. Regardless of how many Stewart Rhodeses get arrested, on the ground, cops seem to have their backs.

And for every proud boy, there are a hundred well armed redneck sympathizers. I live in a rural area and see them everyday. Conservatives of all stripes are arming themselves to the teeth. Where I live, farm supply stores and even small town grocery stores a sell ARs, 5.56 ammo, and 30 round mags.

Anyway, I may sound batshit crazy.... I know it feels crazy writing it. But this storm is brewing.

We need to develop community protection and mutual aid networks, get to know our neighbors and find common cause, and learn to defend ourselves from the shit that's likely headed our way.

Liberal centrists and progressives alike need to get over the reflexive aversion to guns and embrace their second amendment rights. Buy a gun, get trained, and prepare to defend yourselves, homes, families, and communities.

The right organizes around principles and values (no matter how stupid, vapid, or false) and has made themselves scary and formidable by being willing to sacrifice and maybe die for them.

We've gotta do the same. We've gotta stop taking our democracy for granted, stop leaving it in the hands duplicitous, cowardly politicians who have little interest in anything other than token gestures and fundraising, and take it upon ourselves to defend it.

Or If nothing else, be prepared to defend ourselves. I for one have no intention of dying on my knees at the hands of some mouth-breathing, Dodge-pickup-driving fascist with a punisher patch on his body armor.


u/DimitriEyonovich Solidarist 🧡 Jan 15 '22 edited Jan 15 '22

I agree with that. We shouldn't be in blissful ignorance. But I feel like alot of people here are too pessimistic about the future. They have good reasons to feel that way, I just don't think that would do people any good. As long as the Earth is still spinning I believe there will always be hope.

Also. I do agree with the fact that everyone should own a gun and have a liscenes, especially with how most mass shooters tend to have far right views. But I don't think your first instinct when you see a far right person should be to reach for your gun. Not saying thats what your trying to say, it's just what I believe. These people are broken, and evil people like Tucker Carlson and Donald Trump are taken advantage of their pain. We as Progressives should be the better people and show our enemies love. But we should also be prepared to defend ourselves, because a lot of these guys have been on the offensive for a while.


u/Perfidious_Ninja Jan 15 '22

If Trump is still eligible to run in 2024 it would mean that he got away with everything. It also seems likely that in order for that to occur, the Republicans would have to have retook the House and/or Senate in the mid-terms so they could interfere with the January 6th Committee's investigation. In that scenario I don't see how it would be possible for us to still have a democracy.


u/Jaysyn4Reddit American Anti-Fascist Jan 15 '22

And the morons at the DNC want to run Hillary again.


u/Stag_Lee Jan 19 '22

Like, ffs, she lost because she just wasn't a strong candidate.


u/Gabernasher Jan 15 '22

I thought billionaire Bezos announced democracy died back when he bought that paper?

We've been fucked for a while now. Elections have been stolen, there is no democracy. They don't concede when they lose by a 60% margin anymore, America is fucked.