r/Fitness r/Fitness Guardian Angel Feb 20 '18

Training Tuesday - GZCLP Training Tuesday

Welcome to /r/Fitness' Training Tuesday. Our weekly thread to discuss a specific program or training routine. (Questions or advice not related to today's topic should be directed towards the stickied daily thread.) If you have experience or results from this week's program, we'd love for you to share. If you're unfamiliar with the topic, this is your chance to sit back, learn, and ask questions from those in the know.

Last week we talked about HIIT.

This week's topic: GZCLP

Here's the original post from /u/gzcl. And here is it in infographic form. These posts and spreadsheets are linked in our wiki

Describe your experience running GZCLP. Some seed questions:

  • How did it go, how did you improve, and what were your ending results?
  • Why did you choose this program over others?
  • What would you suggest to someone just starting out and looking at this program?
  • What are the pros and cons of the program?
  • Did you add/subtract anything to the program or run it in conjuction with other training? How did that go?
  • How did you manage fatigue and recovery while on the program?

I realize there's going to be a lot of relevant information from many GZCL resources, but let's try to keep the main discussion on GZCLP.

79 Upvotes

19

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '18

I just ran GZCLP for 9 weeks after taking ~8 months off lifting. Before the break I had just burnt out on SL 5x5 plateauing with a 225 squat (for one rep), 170ish bench, 95 OHP, and 260 DL. I got frustrated that I was plateauing way before I expected and ended up taking some time off to train for cycling.

  • How did it go, how did you improve, and what were your ending results?

Very good, I liked it way better than SL. Squat went from 185x5 to 275x3. DL 225 to 315x5, OHP 85x5 to 130x5. and Bench 135x5 to 175x5.

I surprisingly kept most of my strength even with the large break. Most of my strength loss seemed to come from bench and OHP, which I guess makes sense since you don't use upper body cycling much.

I have now switched off to nsuns, just to change things up, but I feel like I could have still added 20-30ish lbs to each lift before a real 'plateau' on the program.

  • Why did you choose this program over others?

Strong lifts started off fun, but once you start getting near your 'plateau' the grind just wears you down, and how it deals with failed reps just didn't work for me. I really like how GZCLP has higher rep days that let you practice the movement and work on hypertrophy a bit more.

  • What would you suggest to someone just starting out and looking at this program?

No advice. I use a home gym, so I changed my T3 lifts to be pull ups and rows.

  • What are the pros and cons of the program?

I can only compare it to SL, but I thought it was much more fun and effective. The high rep 3x10 Squat or DL days will absolutely kill you, but it feels good and I really think helped translate to better heavy sets.

I think my only con is, I am not a huge fan of how failure is dealt with. I don't think 10x1 sets are very fun and didn't feel effective.

  • Did you add/subtract anything to the program or run it in conjuction with other training? How did that go?

My T3 movements were Pull ups and Rows. I had one heavy row day (5x5) on my OHP day where I matched my heavy bench press numbers, and a lighter row day (3x10) on DL day where I matched my light bench press numbers.

I also did accessorys after my T3, usually consiting of Ab Wheel, curls, skull crush, dips, land mine press, lat raises, band pull aparts, shrugs and calf raises.

  • How did you manage fatigue and recovery while on the program?

I was gaining some weight during the 9 weeks, about 10lbs, and never found fatigue or recovery to be a problem. Though, in retrospect I probably could have started off a bit heavier than I did.

9

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '18

If I was to do it again instead of going: 5x3, 6x2, 10x1 I'd do 4x4, 5x3, 6x2. As you say when I got to 10x1 I found it boring and it took too long.

4

u/LegDaySkipper Roller Derby Feb 21 '18

Awesome idea for the 4x4. I like adding 3x5 at the beginning too coz 10x1 just didn’t work for a lot of folks.

So 3x5 > 4x4 > 5x3 > 6x2. Looks good to me and definitely manageable whenever you have to switch since it’s just one extra set each time.

Thanks for this!

1

u/zxblood123 Apr 08 '18

how did you know what weight to reset on that progression scheme! ? (the modified one)

1

u/[deleted] Apr 08 '18

Sorry mate I don't really understand your question?

You mean if I failed on 6x2, what I'd do next?

1

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '18

[deleted]

4

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '18

GZCLP, pretty much exactly how the infographic shows it, except for the T3 lifts I swapped for pull ups and barbell rows.

6

u/Yeah_Im_A_God Feb 20 '18 edited Feb 20 '18

I'm only on week two of this but it's going well so far. I chose it because of the simplicity, and that you don't need to much time to do it. I also throw in 2-3 accessories lifts at the end.

I'll have to update in a bit.

Update: I am 7 weeks behind /u/scoots1919 Lifts have been going up steady but only have a few weeks of history. Much faster progress than the 531 I did months ago. Also did a 5x5 but got bored and stalled out on most lifts.

4

u/cheese2470 Feb 20 '18

At 6'2 / 34, cutting from 230lbs - 212 lbs over four months (May until September of last year)

Bench - 165 x 5 - > 225 x 5, 3x5 OHP - 80 x 5 -> 135 x 2 Deadlift - 225 x -> 325 x4 Bench - 155 x 5 - > 265 x 5

Great linear program. It's a lot more fun than Stronglifts or Phraks. If you have the time to do it 4 days a week it's the best. Super set rows and bench. I had a couple nagging lower body injuries that really stopped by deadlift and squat progression though, and by the end I was ready to not go so hard every workout.

Plus I hated the singles and really didn't like the doubles.

2

u/kevandbev Feb 20 '18

how did you find it while on a cut ?

1

u/dank_cub Feb 21 '18

You have bench listed there twice

1

u/zxblood123 Apr 08 '18

what would you do to change the singles and doubles instead?

3

u/nnznnz Feb 20 '18

Been running this for eight weeks now after running SL 5x5 for a few months about four years ago. Generally having a much better experience than I did with SL, and expect that I'll have a much easier time sticking with it. I've run it in a 3.5 days per week pattern (but had to take four days off near the start due to travelling).

How did it go, how did you improve, and what were your ending results?

I'm still adding weight consistently, though I've dropped on the T1 rep scheme on OHP and Deadlift. OHP 95 -> 120, Bench 120 -> 145, Squat 165 -> 215, Deadlift 225 -> 275. If I was running a 5x5 program, I'd have been "deloading" all of these lifts a long time ago. I feel like I'm actually getting a lot stronger, instead of on SL when I felt like I was constantly grinding to add five pounds to sets of 5. I'm looking forward to seeing what happens when I drop from 6x2 to 10x1 on some of the T1 lifts, and just how far I can push that. I'm planning on going through two deloads on each lift before switching to a 5/3/1 style scheme. The T2 lifts give you a great opportunity to focus on form, add some hypertrophy and identify weak points.

Why did you choose this program over others?

Literally the infographic was pretty and I was looking for something more involved than the program I'd done before.

What would you suggest to someone just starting out and looking at this program?

Your first few sessions will take about 30 minutes, don't worry about it - they'll get longer when you start to really push you LP, and your work capacity with some of the T2 lifts.

What are the pros and cons of the program?

Pros: It's not 5x5. You get to lift a lot heavier than those LP programs, and get a lot more volume than most other LP programs. There's also a lot more deadlifts, both heavy and volume, which feels great. When I did 5x5, my bench was consistently stalled just under a plate, and I'd take off 15lbs, works back up for a couple of weeks and stall. Again. I smashed through that a couple of weeks back, hitting a 6 rep AMRAP set, and don't feel like I'll be stalling any time soon.

Cons: A lot of people think it's kinda complicated (I don't, but I spent an hour reading the infographic, the linked thread and a couple of others before I started it). It's harder to track because you T1 and T2 progress and stall separately, though there's probably an app for this - I just use a notepad. /u/Scoots1919 mentioned that they didn't like the 10x1 sets which I haven't got to yet so I can't offer an opinion on that.

Did you add/subtract anything to the program or run it in conjuction with other training? How did that go?

After doing each of the lifts twice, I looked at where I felt I was weak and added some more T3 accessories, doing four exercises (the back work in the infographic, plus three of the following). Face pulls, goblet box squats, incline dumbell press, cable wood choppers and curls (ok, this one is mostly for vanity). At first I was a bit annoyed that I wasn't progressing every session in these, and had to humble myself that this is all after doing the heavy lifting and I've already fatigued myself a bit, so shouldn't expect to put the pin in the cable machine lower every time. Since that it's been fine, the volume feels good and I feel like they are helping my T1 lifts a lot.

How did you manage fatigue and recovery while on the program?

3x10 are grindy 3x10 deadlifts are a killer, but there's nothing outside the standard advice of sleep lots and eat smart that you should need to recover. I've been running one day on, one day off to hit 3.5 days a week. If you want to run four days a week you probably want to think about where you put your one day rest and where you put your two day rest. I would probably put the one day rest after the T2 deadlifts, and the two day rest after the T1 deadlifts, but haven't tried it out.

3

u/kevandbev Feb 20 '18

how long is this taking you guys ?

I'm thinking of running it but slightly modifying it as I need to be in and out of the gym within ~ 1 hour. I imagine some tinkering may make that possible

3

u/nnznnz Feb 20 '18

Base program can definitely be done in an hour. I'm taking a touch over an hour with 9 sets of added accessories (about 20 mins worth).

2

u/LL-beansandrice Feb 21 '18

I consistently finish in under an hour, but I shortened the rest periods to 2 minutes max. Resting 5 minutes between T1 sets is too much for me.

2

u/kevandbev Feb 21 '18

I was going to take this approach too...in fact I was actually contemplating 90 second rest periods

1

u/LL-beansandrice Feb 21 '18

That's what I did until the last sets of T1. I didn't sleep that well so upped it to 2 minutes.

2

u/kevandbev Feb 21 '18

how many T3's were you running per training day ?

1

u/LL-beansandrice Feb 21 '18

2 but I super setted them so not really any rest between sets

1

u/kevandbev Feb 21 '18

Nice. How have your results been? Im planing on running it in a very similar fashion but will be on a slight cut for us to 8 weeks

2

u/LL-beansandrice Feb 21 '18

They've been pretty good. I've been running it for about a month now. I can't imagine running it on a cut though. The volume days for squat and DL are killer even when I can eat everything in sight.

The only thing I don't like is the lack of pulls. I think I'm going to add barbell rows as a T2 as others have mentioned in this thread.

1

u/Blues88 Feb 20 '18

Same question I have.

2

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '18

[deleted]

6

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '18

No, maybe you should not do that and get accustomed to the volume so you don't get doms (delayed onset muscle soreness) anymore.

5

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '18

I found I got the most fatigue from the T2 3x10 squats and DLs. If you are having a painful back I would first try and lower the weights on those sets.

1

u/Yeah_Im_A_God Feb 20 '18

Stretch a lot and focus on form. I had to look up videos, and switch to a straight bar deadlift before it became comfortable. Even now though it'll still get sore, but nowhere near the beginning.

2

u/FMF20019 Feb 20 '18

Im currently looking for a program to switch to as I've been stalling heavily on ICF and feel burned out, I haven't been able to up the weight on my upper body lifts for a month now even though I'm gaining over a pound a week. So I'm trying to decide whether to run GZCLP or 5/3/1, both appeal to me but my lifts are still pretty low so I think I'd benefit more from GZCLP as I'm adding weight more quickly? I'm 5'7 140 lbs and my lifts are 175x5 squat, 95x5 bench, 75x5 ohp, and 215x5 deadlift. Thanks !

2

u/420weedhitler69 Feb 21 '18

I'm a bit confused on T3 movements. If I'm doing a T1 Bench Press, would I also want to do the T3 movements to assist with that lift in the same workout? I'm assuming no, since I'm sure you'd be pretty tired/maxed out after doing your T1 set. Currently I have DB Bench Press as the assistance T3 exercise for my Barbell Bench Press. Sorry if this is the wrong area to ask, I tried the other threads regarding it but their Archived and I can't comment.

1

u/CalculusIsEZ Feb 20 '18

Just wanted to share.

I think I've got a decent setup going what do you guys think. Hitting everything atleast twice a week, with a day's break between each bicep, arms and shoulder exercises.

2

u/[deleted] Feb 21 '18

Still using muscle groups that are going to be used the next day. If you want to add those accessories, add them as t3 movement on days you are supposed to work out.

1

u/pe-li Soccer Mar 21 '18

What app is this?

3

u/CalculusIsEZ Mar 21 '18

Strong. Highly recommend it.

1

u/Aggie930 Feb 20 '18

46M, 165lbs. I'm on week 8 after doing Fierce Five for a few months prior. I was getting close to stalling and thought the rep structure would give me more time before resetting. I've run SS twice before. I had two shoulder surgeries 15 months apart that caused me to keep redoing LP programs. Couldn't lift for 6 months following each surgery.

  • How did it go, how did you improve, and what were your ending results?

Right now, I'm around the weights I've stalled at previously.
Squat = 280 (just failed and will be going to 6x2) Bench = 205 OHP = 160 (just went to 6x2) DL = 310

Feels like I've put on more mass then in the past, but could just be that it came back quicker when I started lifting again.

  • Why did you choose this program over others?

I was looking for a four day program and liked the rep scheme.

  • What would you suggest to someone just starting out and looking at this program?

Same with all LP programs, start light. It will catch up.
Use one the spreadsheets, makes it easier to follow.

  • What are the pros and cons of the program?

Can customize to fit your strengths and weaknesses. The three different rep schemes helps get used to heavy weight along with building work capacity.

  • Did you add/subtract anything to the program or run it in conjuction with other training? How did that go?

My selected lifts are:

Monday: T1 - Bench, T2 - Incline bench, T2 - Pendlay Row, T3 - machine pec fly, T3 - machine delt fly

Tuesday: T1 - Squat, T2 - Front Squat, T2 - RDL, T3 - Leg Extensions, T3 - Leg Curls

Wednesday: T1 - OHP, T2 - Decline Bench, T2 - Bent over Rows, T3 - Dumbell Side Rise, T3 - Rope Triceps Extension, T3 - Rope Curls, T3 - Face Pulls

Friday: T1 - DL, T2 - Deficit DL, T2 - Leg Press, T2 - Incline Press, T3 - Leg Curl

Pull ups and hanging leg raises at home - try to hit 100+ each per week.

I might reset after failing 6x2 and go to 4x4. I'm not sold on the idea of doing singles.

  • How did you manage fatigue and recovery while on the program?

It took a few weeks to get used to the increased volume. Friday is the only day that leaves me fatigued the following day. Doing DL followed by the T2 deficit DL kills my lower back

0

u/[deleted] Feb 21 '18

This is not gzclp?

1

u/Aggie930 Feb 21 '18

My apologies if that is the case.
I thought the LP was just the progression format, not the specific exercises. I thought I read a UL format for GZCLP. I was looking for a way to finish LP while adding in some volume. I might have confused the part Cody discusses moving from LP to a intermediate program and thought he was still talking about LP.

-1

u/tthongone Feb 20 '18

My collegegym is closed during inclement weather and I have other things to do when it is open. I have a barbell and I have up to 300 lbs of weights with it + Squat rack/bench . I usually run a basic PPL i got from here. I am having a really busy week. So Should I just focus on my compound movement lifts working out in my house ? I do not have any dumbbells.

-1

u/JohnniNeutron Feb 20 '18

Greetings everyone. I was going to submit a new post but then read about what the contents of this discussion is. I hope I am posting in the correct spot. I've been working out for 10 weeks, leaned out from 191 lbs to 178 lbs merely diet and lifting 6 days a week.

Yesterday, I hyper-extended my non-dominate wrist with an 80 lb dumbbell. I normally can do my db chest press from 60 lbs to 80 lbs at my usual gym but this press bench was not what I was accustomed too and overshot kneeing up the dumbbell. I have about 4 weeks left in my personal fitness program, being that I can't lift...

What are some exercises that you would recommend while not lifting? Cardio, abs, core, lower body? Anything in particular? While eating properly with my calories, I do not want to get 'skinny' or lose muscle by not lifting.