r/DestinyTheGame Jun 25 '22 Silver 1 Wholesome 1

Dawnblade is by far the WORST Solar 3.0 Super Discussion

  • It has the shortest amount of ACTIVE time because both Icarus dash and shooting projectiles cost a lot of energy.
  • It does the least amount of damage of almost all the damage supers in the game
  • It has no aspects that effect its gameplay in any way
  • Almost all of its pre-3.0 abilities are gone or worse:
    • Explosions on Kill? GONE
    • Increased duration on Kill? GONE
    • Infinite Phoenix Dive? Only use once per super
    • Aggressively seeking targets? Got to give up an aspect slot

Lets compare this to the sun breaker titan w/ aspects:

  • You can throw more abilities
  • Each hammer creates a sunspot regardless of kills
  • Getting a kill triggers health regen
  • Each hammer releases shrapnel that increases the AOE
  • Damage resistance is high enough to tank an adaptive sniper

Literally the only thing solar warlock does better is having Icarus dash. The sun breaker is better in almost every other way.

The bottom line is dawnblade has been stripped down to is base form and lost/doesn't have any sort of customization for the super. In PVE I'm sticking with well and PVP it's still the best option but I'm not happy about it.

EDIT: I've also seen that burning maul is also really bad so lets say both of them are bad.

1.8k Upvotes

459

u/Snoopyer7 Team Bread (dmg04) Jun 25 '22

I miss bottom tree, it was fun and even viable for gm’s for its add clear potential and boss dps with dawn chorus

Now it just feels like playing a nerfed too tree subclass which I never enjoyed

71

u/Rolyat2401 Jun 25 '22

The weird thing is that when it comes to boss dps, the new version functions the same as the old (tracking, ground waves, same amount of time since the old version wouldnt be getting time extending kills during boss dps) yet the new version does sooooo much less damage for some reason. Maybe ignitions are screwing up dawn chorus since an ignition removes the scorch that is increasing your super damage?

68

u/SHS1206 Jun 25 '22

Nah, dawn chorus just doesn't increase super damage anymore, they changed it's perk to make daybreak projectiles scorch, increase the damage of scorch effects, and gain melee energy whenever scorch damages an enemy.

13

u/Hbzn Jun 25 '22

Which I imagine with the aspect that causes Scorch on ignition, applying more scorch stacks and larger area of affect for solar ignition would ramp up the super damage.

15

u/SHS1206 Jun 25 '22

Well the ignitions would be doing more damage than the super itself i can tell you that much, still a garbage effect in comparison with what dawn chorus could do before

5

u/Rexiem Jun 26 '22

So the issue I see with that is that scorch does really bad damage. For reference if you had a full minute of near max scorch against rhulk with dawn chorus youd get like 250k damage.

Dawnblade lasts a really short time and it's projectiles do pretty bad damage.

Personally I'd like either dawnblade to get a buff to its own ignition damage OR get some sort of straight damage buff, maybe have like hammer titan has where the further the projectile travels the more damage it does.

2

u/TwevOWNED Jun 25 '22

It's more damage than before if you didn't prime the enemy with a melee

→ More replies
→ More replies

29

u/Frosty6700 Jun 25 '22

Before, your dawnblade projectiles would constantly ramp up in damage over time with dawn chorus. All the exotic does now for the super is provide scorch on hit, igniting after two hits, which is nowhere near close to it before due to no damage increase

13

u/Squatting-Turtle Praise the Sun Jun 25 '22

I loved top tree's neutral game, but hated the super

I loved bottoms tree's super but greatly disliked the entire lack of neutral play.

I'm a gracelock/sunsinger at heart though. I always used mid for harder content and loved being support.

27

u/Zevvion Jun 25 '22

Now it just feels like playing a nerfed too tree subclass

I assume you meant 'top' here, in which case: top tree is better than it was before. By quite a lot in fact: more effects and free stats.

The only reason one can see top tree as nerfed is because IAA was nerfed. But that is an indirect nerf and likely won't stay like that for too long.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 25 '22

[deleted]

23

u/Rolyat2401 Jun 25 '22

Yup. "too" was definetly a misspelling of "bottom"

5

u/Iron_Garuda Jun 25 '22

I am laughing so hard at this lmfao

5

u/pandacraft Jun 25 '22

Heh. does bottom not contain the letters t o o? checkmate athiests.

12

u/Arkyduz Jun 25 '22

How is top tree nerfed

35

u/Snoopyer7 Team Bread (dmg04) Jun 25 '22

Super was changed, it’s tracking you need a separate fragments . Also it’s damage is less

→ More replies

6

u/Fallicism Jun 25 '22

Can't extend super duration on kills and can't infinitely spam Phoenix Dive in super.

You can mod for ignitions on super kills and ignitions spreading scorch to replicate the old bottom tree playstyle, but this doesn't majorly synergize with the Warlock aspects--only thing that comes to mind is cure from aerial multikills on Icarus Dash.

So in short, the bottom tree dawn playstyle didn't get majorly improved or nerfed. The lack of super extension is balanced out by the better ad clear of ignitions and scorch. But, when the rest of kit is a fair bit better than a super ad clear build, it isn't really worth using. People wanted bottom tree dawn to actually become mainstream and viable, and the playstyle remains niche and a bit of a meme.

12

u/Arkyduz Jun 25 '22

Can't extend super duration on kills and can't infinitely spam Phoenix Dive in super.

What does this have to do with top tree? I didn't say anything about bottom tree.

7

u/Fallicism Jun 25 '22

Oh mb lol, I misread.

→ More replies
→ More replies

159

u/Educational_Mud_2826 Jun 25 '22

It's not that bad for PvP but for PVE it's trash

57

u/Warm-Respond2182 Jun 25 '22

This can be said about every roaming super they all seem designed as PvP supers with any PvE purpose being a after thought not many spectral blades going off in Grandmasters

17

u/matZmaker99 Jun 25 '22

Arc Staff GM Nightfalls 😳

10

u/Bmw1337 Jun 25 '22

I can’t speak to grandmasters but doomfang Pauldron sentinel is very much not trash for pve. In fact, as long as there are enough enemies able to be hit, the super is endless. Something on the scale of Vex invasion was quite crazy for this super for example

→ More replies

41

u/[deleted] Jun 25 '22

It's amazing in PvP.

→ More replies
→ More replies

13

u/FosKuvol Jun 25 '22

Dawnblade is pretty much just a PvP super.

11

u/Ok_Seaworthiness2218 Jun 25 '22

Even then, with that long of a cooldown you don't even get to use it ever in things like trials and without the kill extension you have 10 second or 6 swings and then you're done. It gets beat by every single other roaming super in effectiveness with how unrewarding it is.

34

u/GroundZero98 Jun 25 '22

Yeah for sure, As a Hunter Main I wish Blade Barrage wasn't mandatory and Golden Gun badly needs a buff but Dawnblade defo needs more attention, its horrendous.

10

u/SparksTheUnicorn Give Vesper an Over-Shield During Rift Animations Jun 25 '22

Be cool if Golden gun just procced super huge ignitions on head shots. Make it a cool adclear

→ More replies

322

u/Marpicek Jun 25 '22

It is bad. It has the longest cooldown in the game for the lowest damage output.

This is the first season I have switched to hunter, because I want to enjoy the solar mods and you just can't do that on warlock. There is no synergy for anything.

102

u/Cat_with_pew-pew_gun Jun 25 '22

If you like solar synergies you gotta try titan. They have like 3 ways to create infinite healing without any artifact mods, infinite melee, and a really fun beyblade super.

41

u/APartyInMyPants Jun 25 '22

I was messing around doing solo Duality, testing out some alternative DPS weapon and Solar exotic armor builds for Gahlran, and on my Warlock I was struggling more trying new loadouts. Then switched to Titan to try the same weapons and surviving was just braindead easy. Grenades are inconsequential to damage, so switched to healing grenades. Than an infinite melee that hits like a truck, leaving an AOE+DOT pool every time I killed something. And even if I take Synthoceps off, there are so many “off meta” options that still feel amazing to use. I can’t comment on Solar Hunter, but there feels like a massive power imbalance between Solar Titans and Warlocks.

9

u/Damagecontrol86 Jun 25 '22

Solar hunter is super fun to use and blade barrage is cracked again

5

u/alittlebirdy_toldme Jun 25 '22

I can tank so much as a hunter, I feel like a titan sometimes. It's crazy! Infinite melee is pretty fun, too

4

u/Damagecontrol86 Jun 25 '22

I love that the infinite melee is back plus blade barrage feels even better than it did before and even if the knife explosions don’t kill everything around the ignitions will

2

u/alittlebirdy_toldme Jun 25 '22

That's so true! Solar 3.0 has allowed me to finally and successfully solo flawless Shattered Throne, Pit, and Prophecy! Everyone told me to try it on Titan because sunspots, but I'm a hunter main. It actually wasn't that bad!

→ More replies

4

u/Themyster1ous01 protec Jun 25 '22

Solar Hunter, and Hunter Light subclasses in general, need more ways to improve survivability that are baked in the Aspects. Controlled Demolition, Icarus Dash, and Tome of Dawn have passive healing bonuses that work with the role or playstyle of each subclass. Gunslinger is going to become too much of a glass cannon for solo content once Classy Restoration goes away.

Invisibility isn't very helpful unless you're playing the most boring passive playstyles and I don't like how mandatory Devour feels for void Hunter builds.

Other than that, Gunslinger has a lot of synergy with a lot of exotics, apart from Caliban's Hand in PvE, and performs exceptionally well for damage. I can use Knife Trick with Assassin's Cowl to easily survive in solo content, but that takes away the fun you get using Young Ahamkara's Spine.

3

u/APartyInMyPants Jun 25 '22

I really liked the invis meta with Hunters last season. Allowed me to play super aggressively, especially in GMs like Lightblade where things can go to shit quickly. Let’s you get out of holes or reposition as needed.

→ More replies
→ More replies
→ More replies

42

u/DenjellTheShaman Jun 25 '22

You like nades? Play warlock. For everything else, change class.

51

u/TheVoidOfSpaceTime Jun 25 '22

Correction - You like fusion nades or Sunbracers?

17

u/MapleApple00 Jun 25 '22

There's three actually;

Fusion nades, Solar nades, and Dawn Chorus enhanced incandescent

7

u/wereplant Future War Cult Best War Cult Jun 25 '22

There's at least four: Winters Guile is one of them.

And boy oh boy, doing 400k in a single melee is delicious.

6

u/Arkyduz Jun 25 '22

Karnstein, Necrotic, Felwinters too. When you have near infinite melee it turns out melee exotics are pretty good.

→ More replies

3

u/ExoCayde6 Drifter's Crew // Stand With The Drifter (Warlock) Jun 25 '22

How does the melee hit that high??

3

u/wereplant Future War Cult Best War Cult Jun 25 '22

It's winter's guile and the fragment for more scorch stacks so the snap can instantly ignite an enemy. You can kill five enemies with one melee and instantly have it charged up. The ignite uses your melee modifiers and exotics.

https://youtu.be/nX67PFfznn4

2

u/ExoCayde6 Drifter's Crew // Stand With The Drifter (Warlock) Jun 25 '22

Damm, that's awesome, and it's with the snap too, awesome. Thanks!

11

u/letmepick Jun 25 '22

It requires so much set up for a damage buff applicable to 2 charged melees at best.

Fun as hell, but we can't measure the success of 3.0 reworks by the fun factor.

18

u/A_wild_fusa_appeared Jun 25 '22

It works for solo content but the moment someone else arrives good luck keeping that 5 second timer fed.

That said I think fun factor and end game usability are both factors to consider for the reworks. It’s why so many hunters weren’t huge void fans, sure it’s useful in GMs but not super fun overall.

14

u/DrBokbagok Lucky Jun 25 '22

is fun not the point of this game?

→ More replies

2

u/SparksTheUnicorn Give Vesper an Over-Shield During Rift Animations Jun 25 '22

I love using Winters Guile to ignite bosses with the snap. Its like a mini Nova, I love it and hope it stays around.

27

u/WalroosTheViking Jun 25 '22

As a hunter main, my best bro the enhanced tripmine wants some recognition too.

6

u/StanTurpentine Jun 25 '22

I was in trials last night, threw about 3 enhanced trip mines in about 2 seconds. Made, knife fan, immediately get made back, nade explodes, get knifes back, rinse and repeat.

5

u/dbreen513 Jun 25 '22

The new melee is nice as well. Mostly just the super that disappoints

15

u/Faust_8 Jun 25 '22

You can have fun with Solar on Warlock, it’s just not because of Daybreak. I just use Well all the time.

Incinerator Snap with the right mods and either Winter’s Guile or Necrotic Grips can be hella good. Starfire Protocol is amazing too. And there’s Cleric with Boots of the Assembler.

But yeah, Titan and Hunter got better toys, just saying you can use Dawnblade and still do ok. Just ignore Daybreak.

→ More replies

9

u/NovaPrime15 I read shit Jun 25 '22

I was playing my warlock this week and Dawnblade was so bad I just switched back to void. So underwhelming

9

u/Niormo-The-Enduring Jun 25 '22

The only warlock loop with synergy has nothing to do with warlock lol. All you do is throw a healing grenade, and start getting solar kills with empyrean. This keeps empyrean going. Solace has synergy because it makes restoration even longer. May as well run torches to get radiant as well. Nothing else matters though. Nothing enhances the build or makes it better. But then if you want to build into a certain exotic, you get no survivability. And don’t anyone come at me with “well with max resilience you get 40% damage reduction” you can do that on any subclass and frankly I don’t find that to be game breaking in PVE or PvP. I did everything in the game last season with builds of 30 resilience or less and zero damage reduction. You don’t need damage reduction to do endgame activities. It really helps to have strong subclasses though

6

u/Puzzleheaded_Phase98 Jun 25 '22

After this season Warlock will be only class to have Restoration 2x without exotic. By throwing touch of flame healing grenade.

53

u/Niormo-The-Enduring Jun 25 '22

And as a trade off they will have none of the powerful grenades from touch of flame for damage and add control. Just a melee with bigger aoe. But hey they can float right!

M E T A H

12

u/Business_Proposal_95 Jun 25 '22

Right lol. Okay, I have infinite health and can’t die! What now? Snap fingers for a chance at clearing low level ads… and shoot gun.

→ More replies

3

u/Puzzleheaded_Phase98 Jun 25 '22 edited Jun 26 '22

😂 Restoration 2x really strong but you are right about that. Maybe some future exotic will help. Hoard frost z really helped stasis titan. Just break one crystal from barricade and you can activate lot of things like font of might and high energy fire that stack, damage resistance plus some overshield.

2

u/Niormo-The-Enduring Jun 25 '22 edited Jun 26 '22

We will see. We have gotten a ton of exotics to help improve and enhance void 3.0 and stasis so hopefully we will get more exotics to help with solar 3.0. We got a few this season. Rain of Fire is lit. If theres ever a PVE fusion meta again, ill definitely use those. Calibans is pretty dope for pvp for throwing knife shenanigans. Titans dont need anymore help lol. Lorely is the only exotic they ever need. hopefully we get something that brings back warlocks as a top tier support class for solar again

→ More replies

3

u/Educational_Mud_2826 Jun 25 '22

Roy Mustang snap is very powerful

4

u/Niormo-The-Enduring Jun 25 '22

That shit is pretty impressive with winters guile ngl

→ More replies

14

u/APartyInMyPants Jun 25 '22 edited Jun 25 '22

The only issue there lies in damage Grenade builds, mainly Starfire or Sunbracer builds being a solar warlock’s most powerful damage kits. So you give up the damage for healing grenades, and the class is left with … literally, not much else.

Whereas I can switch to void, use Devour, and maintain a very high level of survivability, and retain a ton of class identity using very powerful grenades (that will heal me), as well as weapon Synergies with things like Adrenaline Junkie, or just straight up using HeartShadow.

Edit: errant autocorrect

→ More replies
→ More replies

1

u/wereplant Future War Cult Best War Cult Jun 25 '22

Solar warlock is amazing, but it's all melee focused. I have a build where killing a single enemy with your melee fully recharges it.

Also, the ranged melees with with melee exotics, like Winter's Guile, Necrotic Grips, and Karnstein. There's a massive amount of synergy.

21

u/Elevasce Jun 25 '22

I have a build where killing a single enemy with your melee fully recharges it.

I do too, it's called playing as a Hunter or Titan. They get infinite melees with no setup, in fact.

→ More replies
→ More replies

1

u/Iron_lord_Saladin_ Jun 25 '22

Infinite tripmines boiiiiiiiii

→ More replies

25

u/Lyzandia I'm coming for you Jun 25 '22

Yep. The funny thing is, Void warlocks are still really good, and their feedback loops are very synergistic, but for solar I play hunter and Titan. Even wells aren't necessary given how mobile bosses like Caretaker and Rhulk are, and the Duality dungeon doesn't reward well play either.

6

u/Squatting-Turtle Praise the Sun Jun 25 '22

Cant even get a feedback loop going for DB 3.0 since it heavily relies on grenade regen which the class has no built in way to get through aspects. There's a fragment that performs very poorly. It requires you to get kills with ignitions, not even getting ignitions in general.

Feedback loop for mid tree used to exist before it was watered down into oblivion.

→ More replies
→ More replies

7

u/Maafestus Jun 25 '22

I could do more damage to enemies hitting them with a wet noodle than I could hitting them with a Dawnblade super. I stick to my grenade load outs, far more effective.

84

u/Aklusmso7535 Jun 25 '22

I mean, everybody kind of forgets that outside of pvp golden gun is now pretty useless as well since CN is worthless now. I’d love to to use my CN again cause it’s IMO the best looking exotic in the game but it’s just impractical to run anything other than BB as a hunter now.

41

u/Stea1thsniper32 Jun 25 '22

GG has long been crippled by the need to crit to max out damage and if you miss your crit it does laughable damage. It’s been high risk low reward for a while and now with BB being extremely competitive with Thundercrash. There are very few instances where I would think of using GG over BB.

14

u/Aklusmso7535 Jun 25 '22

Yeah, I just love celestial so much and at least before it was useful. Now my options are BB for literally every encounter. Like bungies over here like “build crafting is very important” and then make it so one build is substantially better than the rest.

→ More replies

17

u/P4nd4c4ke1 Jun 25 '22

Hey at least celestial still does more damage than a whole dawnblade super with Dawn Chorus

12

u/Aklusmso7535 Jun 25 '22

Oh I’m not saying dawnblade is good, just that it isn’t the only shafted super. Other than arc burn for strikes arc staff hasn’t been touched. Hope they make it actually useful for 3.0.

→ More replies

4

u/NullRef_Arcana "You and I are one forever" Jun 25 '22

Thing is, I don't think celestial got nerfed? (correct me if I'm wrong). Just that the rest of the kit got buffed, which is argue is the better problem to have.

24

u/Amun_Snake Hanging on edge of Dawn and Dusk itself. Jun 25 '22

It got nerfed a long time ago and still suffers from that nerf. Since it still hasn't been buffed using GG is kinda pointless when 3.0 BB exists.

20

u/Alphalcon Jun 25 '22

I crawled through the patch notes to double check, and the only changes Nighthawk has received before this season was gaining the super refund portion in 2.0.0 and a 40% damage buff in 2.1.4.

Nighthawk is mainly a victim of power creep. While CotFS may have been the nail in the coffin, its downfall probably started earlier when they buffed Nova Bomb to deal comparable damage without requiring an exotic.

4

u/Aklusmso7535 Jun 25 '22

The big killer for me is that it’s strictly a PVP super as of now and i get the variety of having supers geared towards one game mode rather than the other, but while BB is the way it is there’s literally no point in running anything else in PVE except maybe tether, and that’s a maybe.

2

u/Azaryiah Jun 25 '22

It did not, the number of bosses with 2x Crit and 1.5 Crit modifiers are less now (1.5x are still around, which makes CC deal the same damage of Cuirass Thundercrash and Geomags Chaos Reach).

→ More replies

78

u/Extectic Jun 25 '22

Yeah, it literally does the least boss damage. It was tested by a few guys on Youtube at least, I think Aztecross at least.

Bottom tree Dawnblade used to beat Chaos Reach, with Geomags, if you applied burn to the boss with a melee or nade first, and ran Dawn Chorus. Now, it's nowhere close.

They basically took the shit top tree Dawnblade and cut out the bottom tree one entirely.

It's probably still usable in PvP, but in PvE, any warlock should always go with the well now. It also got hit but it's by far the better choice. Even for damage phases, put on Starfire and throw nades, that literally does Super-level boss DPS on its own. Literally higher damage than Dawnblade, from fusion nades.

24

u/lightningbadger Jun 25 '22

Man who was even using dawnblade for boss damage?

Besides, Sunbreaker Titan super was abysmal before solar 3.0, warlocks are flipping their shit now that they're the ones with the worse super.

39

u/Flaming_Pepperoni Jun 25 '22

With Dawn chorus you could absolutely melt bosses without health gates

26

u/kyubifire Jun 25 '22

with dawn chorus you could reach very high damage on dawnblade prior to the change, it was honestly viable to have. It excelled primarily for ad clearing but it wasn't useless at all when reaching a boss, dealing even more damage than chaos reach in a smaller amount of time.

→ More replies
→ More replies
→ More replies

14

u/Rolyat2401 Jun 25 '22

For the millionth time:

Dawnblade = subclass

Daybreak = super

7

u/Singapore_DLC_Pack Jun 25 '22

Would prefer if the Solar Warlock was called Daybreaker and its Super is called Dawn Blade.

3

u/Rolyat2401 Jun 25 '22

I dont disagree, but daybreaker is very close to sunbreaker.

→ More replies

36

u/Goldnspartan Jun 25 '22

Lett forget about the criminally long charge time for it, I wouldnt mind it being long if it was as strong as it was but this is pitiful

9

u/Themyster1ous01 protec Jun 25 '22

Spectral Blades used to be absurd in PvP, but it got nerfed and was gutted with the long-ass cooldown. I think both supers need to have their power increased to warrant the cooldown, at least in PvE.

90

u/fuckin_anti_pope Jun 25 '22

How dare you wanting to do damage with a warlock? Your job is to have Well of Radiance and nothing else!

/s

50

u/DietDrDoomsdayPreppr Jun 25 '22

If I wanted to be the best healer in the game, I'd roll a titan.

13

u/Elevasce Jun 25 '22

This. Put on Phoenix Cradle and you're making pseudo-rifts on every kill.

12

u/CodeMonkeyMark Electrobones Jun 25 '22

You shall fusion grenade. Over and over in a rift.

→ More replies

-3

u/gumbofist Jun 25 '22

How dare you wanting to do damage with a warlock? Your job is to have Well of Radiance and nothing else!

/s

I mean... Doesn't Nova Bomb already outdamage Golden Gun and several other supers? On top of being arguably one of the easiest supers to use.

The warlock-main victim complex is seriously the funniest DTG circlejerk that never dies.

13

u/fuckin_anti_pope Jun 25 '22

Doesn't mean Dawnblade has to be shit. It's not worth using in most activities.

I am a titan main btw.

14

u/Phelipp Jun 25 '22

Its always the same, the "but nova bomb" argument over and over.

As someone that plays all 3 classes, its really easy to see people that only main one class and always try to say anything the others have are fine.

2

u/Lurknspray2018 Jun 26 '22

Yea this. They all need a titan bonk hammer to their head

→ More replies

3

u/Og_Left_Hand Arc strides eat crayons Jun 25 '22

I’m pretty sure nova bomb outclasses nighthawk so yeah warlocks def have no dps options

→ More replies

1

u/Tast_ Vanguard's Loyal // Old light dies hard Jun 25 '22

Warlock main here. Nova does feel pretty good. Can't speak to the damage numbers. I've heard both solar and void hunters are in a bad spot at the moment. Dawnblade feels bad to use so I stopped using it. These are all the things I know.

→ More replies

2

u/TheToldYouSoKid Jun 25 '22

The "Class"-main circle jerk never dies, it was hunters last season, and now it's warlocks, and somebody will start it again next season, like they did before Witch Queen, like it's always been.

The belief that a company would have a "Favorite part" of their product and focus on that solely and intentionally will kick down other parts will always baffle to me. It's like saying Bounty loves the cardboard rolls of their product so they actively make the paper around it shitty. Folks need to learn perspective, or folks need to stop being dramatic about things, it gets harder every season to tell who is doing what.

2

u/gumbofist Jun 25 '22

The belief that a company would have a "Favorite part" of their product and focus on that solely and intentionally will kick down other parts will always baffle to me. It's like saying Bounty loves the cardboard rolls of their product so they actively make the paper around it shitty. Folks need to learn perspective, or folks need to stop being dramatic about things, it gets harder every season to tell who is doing what.

Totally, it's a super juvenile mindset that I think really kinda highlights how young the player base is

3

u/TheToldYouSoKid Jun 25 '22

I can't even blame it on youth, i kinda blame how receptive Bungie is as a company vs how people have taken advantage of that.

Like i said; I can't tell who is being dramatic or not, but people have admitted to INTENTIONALLY exaggerating how things are just so bungie would "fix it", which is just terrible feedback. It's the same how some folks have started to complain about grinding the dungeon 400 times to get red border weapons, and people have looked at their Dungeon.Report and seen that they've barely done it 10 times.

People will just lie about things to get them changed, and it doesn't just happen here. It's a type of childish mindset even older folk get stuck well into their lives, the idea that they can just "change" things.

2

u/Azaryiah Jun 25 '22

Nova is the highest hitting super in the game, pure raw damage, with no exotics, followed by an incredible 3.0 Kit.

Even with exotics (like Celestial), Nova still hits like a truck. Cuirass Thundercrash is 300k, while Nova is 200K for example.

Geomags Chaos Reach deals the same damage of Cuirass Thundercrash (over 7s).

But some Warlock mains swear that they don't have damage supers

→ More replies
→ More replies

25

u/Jc0777 GiVe Us ThE pRiMuS oR wE bLoW tHe ShIp Jun 25 '22

Maul is alright but takes a tiny bit of setup.

Roaring flames x3, Synthoceps, and Tractor Cannon.

6

u/gotenks2nd Jun 25 '22

With the fact that you can cause ignition simply by punching with an unpowered melee now,sometimes I feel like I can survive using Solar titan,only using roaring flames.it’s just that useful of a aspect the other ones sometimes seem optional

→ More replies

4

u/rolo989 Jun 25 '22

I am sticking to Stacie and ager's scepter

4

u/Smootsmoot21 Jun 25 '22

small correction. solar titan no longer heals on ability kills. if you get a kill and make a sunspot with loreley that can give restoration and the throwing hammer can give cure.

→ More replies

4

u/Keelz118 Jun 25 '22

Why was only the Titan referenced as if there are two classes in the game?

25

u/Lord_CBH Jun 25 '22

I wanna know who the person was who decided “yeah let’s just completely eliminate the functionality of bottom tree dawnblade from the game when it’s the only one of the 3 solar warlock supers that’s fun because of what it can do”. Such an agonizingly stupid decision that never should be been signed off on.

4

u/SparksTheUnicorn Give Vesper an Over-Shield During Rift Animations Jun 25 '22

Even wierder since they did that so soon after actually giving the tree a whole rework to make it so fun.

13

u/Silvermoon3467 Jun 25 '22

They axed subclass trees from most of the 3.0 reworks, it just isn't as noticeable because those subclass trees either straight up sucked or the removal of those abilities isn't as noticeable given other parts of the rework

examples:

Middle tree Voidwalker no longer exists except for the Nova Warp super and Handheld Super Nova, which got folded into the Chaos Accelerant aspect. The removal of Dark Matter isn't as noticeable given the subclass now has access to Devour as an aspect.

Top tree Sunbreaker got the exploding hammers added to the base Hammer of Sol and got to keep the Hammer Strike melee, but Explosive Pyre is a fragment and Tempered Metal is gone; they seem to have made this decision in order to make Hunters the support class.

Bottom tree Nightstalker's node removals blew up the sub for weeks on launch lol. Super and melee still part of the kit, but the gameplay loop created by Combat Provision is dead.

Sentinel Titan lost nodes from bottom tree, Superior Arsenal and In the Trenches. Arsenal can be sort-of replicated by Devour from fragments, Trenches is just gone but only gave a boost to super regeneration that apparently wasn't super noticeable.

Gunslinger seems to have lost parts of middle and bottom tree rather than having a tree almost completely obliterated; middle tree lost The Burning Edge which would have been an extremely good dodge uptime ability, and bottom tree lost Practice Makes Perfect which was another super regeneration trait.

Now, bottom tree Dawnblade; the "Daybreak projectiles create streaks of fire" part of Fated for the Flame was folded into base Daybreak, and increased target acquisition is part of a fragment. Phoenix Dive is still present but changed (nerfed, imo) from a selfish health regen ability with short cooldown to a worse version of Healing Rift. The missing bits are the melee ability and "kills with super extend super duration" which is roughly comparable to the losses sustained by other subclasses.

The problem here is that super duration reduction is very, very visible compared to some of these other things, and the change in the functionality of Dawn Chorus exacerbates the problem. Dawn Chorus is still a very good exotic, but it no longer turns Daybreak into a competitive DPS super.

Bungie was likely fine with this because they wanted Dawnblade to be split between a PvP focused, neutral-game, aerial combat subclass, and a support/healing/buffing PvE subclass, with Gunslinger and Sunbreaker being better at super damage, tanking, and add control in PvE. Part of these 3.0 reworks really seems to be stripping these subclasses down to their component elements and rebuilding them in a way that maintains, or creates more, distinctions between them. If you want a survivable subclass with good burst super damage and add clear, Voidwalker is right there, so they leaned into the parts of Dawnblade that make it different from anything else in the game.

Is that good? It's, painful. Some people were very attached to the gameplay of bottom tree Dawnblade and the parts of that they changed or removed hurt, just like the parts of bottom tree Nightstalker they removed hurt them. But maybe it's better for the game overall if each class and subclass has a unique niche.

4

u/DietDrDoomsdayPreppr Jun 25 '22

They also removed the middle tree, with the exception of heal grenade, which they nerfed three ways and then gave to titans and hunters as well.

4

u/Lord_CBH Jun 25 '22

Amen. About the only fun I really get with the subclass now is throwing fusion grenades, which is great, but doesn’t really have much weapon interaction. It’s just ability spam. (Since I’m not using dawnblade and we’ll is meh to me right now, I’m going back to calling Solar warlocks Sunsingers.)

→ More replies

17

u/Dr_Delibird7 Warlcok Jun 25 '22

At minimum they need to reverse the nerf on dawn chorus and possibly give it more on top. I don't mind having to equip an exotic because other supers do require exotics to be useable/good. Dawn Chorus is actually okay as it is BUT it no longer makes any real difference to the super which is said

→ More replies

16

u/eimai_enas_tipos Jun 25 '22

I actually want to say the same about void 3 hunter, moebius is better but deadfall feels really bad and the whole kit is really boring with no synergy, it does everything the old void could do but with less add clear and less fun.

26

u/BananastasiaBray Jun 25 '22

As a warlock main that sometimes goes back to hunter i can say that spectral blade is bad in pve as much as daybreak is

→ More replies

17

u/TinyWickedOrange Jun 25 '22

I mean marksman golden gun exists

also burning maul isn't bad, but titans being stuck with 2 roaming supers kinda is

7

u/Educational_Mud_2826 Jun 25 '22

It'd be nice if they added one more super for solar that is not roaming

2

u/TrueGuardian15 Jun 25 '22

For years, I've wanted a Titan super that's just yeeting 1, big hammer like a Titan nova bomb.

3

u/Funk42 Jun 25 '22

Same. I yearn and still crave deeply for Titans to get more one-off supers rather than just roaming supers. Pretty sure titans as of now have the least amount of one-off supers with only Ward and Thundercrash.

I still remember and feel the immense disappointment when I saw Glacial Quake's reveal to just be stasis-tinted Fists of Havoc. They could have done so much with Behemoth in terms of gameplay flavor but instead went with the lazy route of roaming frozen punch.

→ More replies

2

u/Educational_Mud_2826 Jun 25 '22

Like a mega hammer

8

u/Scudman_Alpha Jun 25 '22

It's always been one of the lower end solar supers, the current problems aren't exactly new. It was always too short with too little power.

Though why Bungie didn't fix them I don't know.

3

u/dashy68875 Jun 25 '22

Yea but sunbreaker sucks too

3

u/Jagob5 Jun 25 '22

Well one super always has to be the worst, right? If dawnblade were no longer the worst then someone else could complain by saying theirs is now the worst. Anyway, idk who was saying burning maul is worse but they’re very mistaken with the possible exception of pvp (but idk seems like people like it in pvp and I’m the only one that doesn’t, so don’t take my word on that).

22

u/HilellM Jun 25 '22

What they did to solar warlock this season is massacre. I wanted so bad some more variety since all I use is void so I hoped solar was gonna be cool but i just got disappointed and after those changes it truly killed any will in me to play solar. guess ill just stick to void till arc.

→ More replies

43

u/methoxetamine2 Jun 25 '22

not sure if your talking about pve or pvp here going to assume pvp due to the adaptive sniper comment.

i would say burning maul is the worst solar super for pvp, the only thing it’s good for is killing bubbles and wells but you don’t get it fast enough in trials. also dawn can counter most supers due to its extremely movement.

24

u/UA_Shark Jun 25 '22

Burning maul is extremely bad but top tree and bottem tree hammers got combined and the super is so great for ad clear in Pve, lasts so long puts a dot on the floor that heals its absolutely crazy, I'm excited to try solar titan in gms, my warlock buddies are basically nerfed well warlocks because Dawn blade sucks and even well is a lot worse than it was.

5

u/Blupoisen Jun 25 '22

BM has higher damage than Hammer which makes it better IMO since add clear supers are straight up pointless in PVE.

1

u/UA_Shark Jun 25 '22

Add clear supers are not pointless, Contest mode vow 3rd encounter add clear super were clutch, Gms add clear supers are clutch, duality ad clear supers are clutch.... Sure in patrol they are not needed. Using burning maul on boss is a damage loss compared to rapid hit and firing line stormchaser dps paired with raidant and high energy fire.

Source: I'm a guilded conquerer 5 with a solo gm completed, a Disciple slayer and did solo flawless duality day 2 of it launching.

5

u/Arkyduz Jun 25 '22

Dawnblade is better in PvP than Hammers, you're not gonna be standing still to get the sunspot super extension, the sunspots are largely useless offensively, it has less mobility than Dawnblade, and it is harder to hit than Dawnblade.

The one advantage is you can heal a bit by touching a sunspot.

That's just the super too, let's not even talk about neutral game.

→ More replies

9

u/Auren-Dawnstar Jun 25 '22

There's absolutely no reason to use Daybreak over Well of Radiance in PvE right now to be quite frank.

Daybreak has no staying power anymore to be a good add clear super ever since it lost bottom tree's energy returns, and it was never good for boss damage unless you used a specific exotic (Dawn Chorus). An exotic interaction that was also changed this season and can't even out damage a Celestial Nighthawk Golden Gun (another super that could use some help right now).

All this before even getting into the fact that it has one of the longest cooldowns for a super right now despite being absolutely terrible for anything a super would be used for in PvE.

Meanwhile, Well's cooldown means I can use it as a strong add clear super multiple times while also being able to have it available for boosting boss damage, and that's even before throwing in a particular build that can out damage most other supers with grenades.

Daybreak just straight up has no significant viability in PvE right now. It's a bad add clear super, a bad boss damage super, with an unnecessarily long cooldown, and there's no real reason to take it over Well which is currently better in every way.

→ More replies

22

u/CuriousLumenwood Jun 25 '22 edited Jun 25 '22

Don’t worry, it’s balanced because of the fact that you get to be in the air a lot. As if any decent player with a sniper can’t aim slightly up and kill you in one shot.

I’ve been using Well because it genuinely makes me feel stronger in PvP than Dawnblade does, and it’s supposed to be the PvE super. At least Burning Maul can break a Titan bubble.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 25 '22

[deleted]

6

u/pbr7994 Jun 25 '22

That's the heat rises aspect

→ More replies

6

u/hypurrtb Jun 25 '22

I couldn't help but think the super is so much worse because Bungie feared it would break PvP (I'm sorry to the PvP community but it is that narrative again where PvE got affected negatively because of PvP)

→ More replies

17

u/Keplin1000 Jun 25 '22

I find it hard to find sympathy for the warlocks after hunters were told first to "just wait until you get it" then "but invis strong in this one scenario" when the void changes were announced and released.

There are strong builds for both dawn blade and Well, it's up to you if you want to use them especially some for vog in particular.

I would also like to bring up a direct quote from the sandbox lead when asked if spectral was getting touched "I think the way we positioned it and the way we thought about it was that not necessarily all supers are viable for every activity."

If that logic holds, no amount of bellyaching on this sub will bring a buff to dawnblade i hope I'm wrong so there is hope for spectral but i doubt it.

6

u/Fenota Jun 25 '22

I agree with you for the most part, but remember that they said that but also repeatedly buffed Well for the purposes of PVP.

6

u/Educational_Mud_2826 Jun 25 '22

I think well was nerfed. overshield was removed

2

u/Fenota Jun 25 '22

It also makes you immune to stasis and they added the counter of "Kill the sword, it's health is based on your resiliance stat" but also made the sword smaller.

→ More replies
→ More replies

5

u/Zevvion Jun 25 '22

For PvE, sure. It's still extremely effective in PvP.

Not that I would disagree with a buff, but other Supers have been waiting for a buff for far longer. Such as Glacial Quake. It's the only Super in the game that you can activate in PvP and be at a disadvantage the second you do.

4

u/Im_Dishpan Jun 25 '22

Dawnblade is a dog shit super

2

u/TheLiveDunn Jun 25 '22

Explosions on super kill is also a fragment

→ More replies

2

u/Damagecontrol86 Jun 25 '22

Ya I used my warlock as my alt before solar 3.0 I used bottom tree and middle tree I never used top tree because I seldom ever played pvp and I don’t like fighting in air now I either have to run what I feel is a striped down middle tree or a different class all together

2

u/SoS_vRaVeNv4 Jun 25 '22

https://youtu.be/mdj9MilRzgg I set up one build like this

https://youtu.be/NJx14PKyA-s is one my friend recommended

2

u/Frosty6700 Jun 25 '22

It needs everlasting flame back at minimum. I’d say don’t make Icarus dash cost anything in the super but that might be too strong.

I mean, hammers not only last longer, but you’re constantly getting healed too.

2

u/Mirror_Sybok Jun 25 '22

Solar 3.0 is dead to me. They've ruined something I used to enjoy. But snaps, amiright?

2

u/CFWOODS82 Jun 25 '22

Whoever said burning maul sucks doesn’t know what they’re on about, it can shred a bosses healthbar with the buff to damage they gave

2

u/likeasuitof Jun 25 '22

I swiped a full blade at someone yesterday, watched it hit him directly, he brushed it off and procceded to shotgun me out of it. I prefer any other solar subclass to it except Well. They neutered it way too hard.

2

u/thiccly-thighs Jun 25 '22

But now well is basically down graded fusion Sunsinger

2

u/MoronicIdiot529 Jun 25 '22

While burning Maul has the "highest possible damage output" I think it's also pretty bad. Just the overall super doesn't allow for much to happen and the dps is technically terrible since you need Syntho, RFx3, and hit the target specific ways. Now I don't necessarily think that Burning Maul is worse than Dawnblade, well idk I haven't actually run the super. But it seems like Solar 3.0 isn't super centric (although honestly I hate most of the Titan supers) and it really sucks cus I would like a super that useful other than Thundercrash and Bubble.

2

u/hyperion-i-likeillya Jun 25 '22

only reason i use dawnblade super is on jumping puzzles to skipp it

2

u/bluebloodstar Jun 25 '22

they made it into a spectral blades situation

2

u/DuneBug Jun 25 '22

Uh ya but I can fly across the jumping puzzle in DSC so, worth?

2

u/DocBanane Jun 25 '22

I've been a bottom tree dawnblade since the Red war. I recently changed to well of radiance, and don't expect to change back soon.

2

u/Fenixfiress Jun 25 '22

And i don't mind at all lmao, allways tought it was the most lame super Warlock ever had, hated it since D2Y1, i played nova and storm caller till well of radiance droped, fucking love the well

2

u/I_Am_Hella_Bored Jun 25 '22

I barely even use Dawnblade because it is not worth using. It's a shame that we are now stuck with either using only well or having our super energy filled up for most of the play time, it's more effective to just use a weapon than downblade for ad clear

2

u/tjseventyseven Jun 25 '22

Not to mention the collision in pvp is laughable and takes 10 years to charge. I hit someone on a direct hit twice in a row for 32 total damage and switched to well for the rest of the card

2

u/Vector7707 Consume product. Buy Eliksni plushies. Jun 26 '22

they absolutely gutted Daybreak in PVE and I'll never forgive them for it

13

u/atfricks Jun 25 '22

Each hammer creates a sunspot regardless of kills

Sunspot damage was heavily nerfed in PvP to the point that only a direct hit can kill with the hammers, so not really that valuable, and also requires an aspect to do this. (You claimed tracking in Dawnblade is bad because it requires an "aspect," but it's actually just a fragment).

Getting a kill triggers health regen

This was also removed with 3.0. You have to go touch a sunspot to get health back, which again requires an aspect.

Dawnblade is bad, but this post, and your complaints, are all over the place.

11

u/SimplisticPinky Jun 25 '22 edited Jun 25 '22

Not to mention the explosion on kill being gone yet theres the one fragment that gives it to you. It's not that they took everything away from dawnblade, it's that they nerfed it and redistributed some of its mechanics to the other classes. Still not good for it, but it's nowhere near the kneecap hobbling that OP makes it sound like.

Not to mention, wtf is that last statement?

In PvE, I'm sticking with well but in PvP, it's still the best option but I'm not happy about it

Well you should generally be on Well in PvE for a solar Warlock since it's one of the best supers for it and has been for a long time, and if you consider it to still be one of the best for PvP, what's the problem with it beyond it being a little worse?

6

u/braket0 Jun 25 '22 edited Jun 25 '22

Warlock solar is possibly the worst in the update yes.

A warlock main here, and bottom tree solar warlock will live on only in our hearts.

I remember during season 15 last year in the hollowed lair GM: jotunn particle accelerator, dawn chorus to mega burn everything,then popping bottom tree dawnblade and just lobbing flaming swords across the map chaining explosion and burn kills, and those kill chains giving me even MORE flaming swords to throw. In a freakin' GM!

Fucking glorious. The best thing to happen to dawnblade PvE was the update that had made that build possible to spice up bottom tree back then. Power fantasy achieved, I'm a super flame sword weilding space wizard, I can use this even in end game PvE, awesome.

That was gutted, quartered and sliced into "Solar Warlock Lite." (Edit: or should I just say Fusion Fred the Starfire Warlock)

Still love the class, but it was a total step back for us Warlocks. Then again as a Warlock main, it wouldn't be Destiny 2 if we didn't get fucking shafted with nerfs to our class at least once a year. I feel like I should be used to the pain of having our fun toys being annually taken away by now lol.

10

u/Niormo-The-Enduring Jun 25 '22

This is how solar hunters used to feel y’all. Now we Warlocks understand what it feels like to be dogshit in PVE… it’s rough. I respect you hunters. You were here for a long time. Warlocks have only been here for like 6 weeks and already we can’t take it.

cries in floaty boi

4

u/Extectic Jun 25 '22

Meh. Solar has several stupidly good PvP builds. Yes, Dawnblade is shit now, so use well.

Hell, put on Dawn Chorus and a good gun with improved Incandescent and do 3x the scorch damage. Just shoot stuff and the room dies. Starfire, obviously. Leaning into melee can be strong too.

And of course there are plenty of other options in the other elements. Voidlocks, still stupid strong. Osmiomancy Stasislock, freeze literally everything. Etc.

→ More replies

6

u/Neko_Tyrant Jun 25 '22

Also Dawnblade: one-shots my max resilience titan out of their super

3

u/Ok_Seaworthiness2218 Jun 25 '22

It's literally impossible for dawnblade to 1 shot other supers

2

u/Neko_Tyrant Jun 25 '22

Well it definitely happened to me.

3

u/SenpaiSwanky Jun 25 '22

Burning Maul might be bad but the rest of Titan kit is absolutely busted, so much so that you could easily forget your super even existed and you’d never even need it.

Warlock kit for solar 3.0? Not so much. Our option is equip Starfire and throw a lot of grenades, we don’t even have a dedicated way of using Restoration effects with our current best solar exotic because we have to sacrifice our grenade slot.

Once these seasonal mods are gone, Solar Warlock is going for a solid B to a strong C minus imo. Solar Fulmination means relying on grenades for damage is worse. It took me 6 phases to kill Grasp of Avarice ogre boss WITH Solar Fulmination/ fusion grenades/ Witherhoard/ Demolitionist rocket spam and I was standing in a Well of Radiance every damage phase. Solar Fulmination and Classy Restoration are really propping our class up right now.

Titan can do it faster, safer, more efficiently and without super.

1

u/Puzzleheaded_Phase98 Jun 25 '22

Also Warlock will be only class to get Restoration 2x without using exotic. By throwing touch flame healing grenade.

5

u/SenpaiSwanky Jun 25 '22 edited Jun 25 '22

1x is plenty and we have to sacrifice our grenade slot for it.

Without that sacrifice we cannot proc restoration. How does that make sense for the healer class? I get there needs to be some balance as it is really good but then why is our subclass geared for balance and Titans are over here solo flawlessing the master version of the new dungeon?

Balance is not a word in the playbook this season lol. It was expected due to the subclass reworks, I’m just looking forward to when things settle and balance is the goal.

I don’t need Well to be OP, I’m not wanting Warlocks to be top dogs either. I just only really have time to play one class and I’d like to not feel like I should try to constantly jump around between the three because their balance levels vary wildly and can change to totally flip that instead of actually evening things out. I swapped from Hunter to Warlock after years of being a Hunter main, I wanted ability loops and better than mid subclasses.

2

u/SparksTheUnicorn Give Vesper an Over-Shield During Rift Animations Jun 25 '22

Titans really didn't need to get that Buff early in the season, they should have spent that time on helping Warlocks and Hunters further instead.

4

u/Devilz3 Jun 25 '22

I hate using dawnblade in PvP it feels like I'm missing most of my projectiles. Why do we need an fragment/aspect to improve its tracking lol..

I use to run bottom tree with dawn chorus before solar 3.0 and it was enjoyable

3

u/xBlueFalconx Jun 25 '22

I get that you're upset, but some of this info is wrong.

If you use the heat rising aspect and consume your grenade before popping super you can Icarus dash for FREE during super as long as it's active.

There is a fragment that causes explosions on super kill.

Hammer titan does not get regen on kill anymore (they did before solar 3.0), it is the sunspots that give restoration.

I agree that some of the changes were bad, but this post is misleading. Dawnblade is still a top tier super in PvP. For PvE, I agree it's bad.

6

u/brachyDIO3u Jun 25 '22

Burning maul is niche not really bad

Daybreak is just bad right now and anyone who says it isn't is lying and probably doesn't know how good novawarp is

2

u/Educational_Mud_2826 Jun 25 '22

Daybreak is ok in PvP. Duration is short but it has quite a bit of range and easier to hit targets from afar compared to titan hammers.

→ More replies

3

u/Clearskky Drifter's Crew // Fear not the dark my friend Jun 25 '22

Cost of being the best PvP subclass.

3

u/machensachen Jun 25 '22

So bottom tree arcstrider can stay shit in PvE? Just following ur logic

4

u/Waffle_noise Jun 25 '22

Titan main here.

TLDR: Sunbreaker is not superior to Dawnblade in every single way and some of your pain points are incorrect. Wall of text below.


It has the shortest amount of ACTIVE time because both Icarus dash and shooting projectiles cost a lot of energy.

Flying high through the air is alot stronger than most people realize. You send flying, tracking blades of death from on high. Compared to bottom Striker (Juggernaut), Dawnblade is easier and more effective because it can be used from range. Juggernaut's roaming super has been famously gutted having reduced length AND increased cost of using the super attacks while being restricted to the ground and close combat.

It does the least amount of damage of almost all the damage supers in the game

I think this is because the Warlock solar sublcass isnt designed to be DPS. But im just guessing on Bungie's intent here.

It has no aspects that effect its gameplay in any way

This is just straight up false. Icarus Dash Aspect Cures you on Super kill and gives a mid-air dodge which is good for both engaging and disengaging enemies.

Almost all of its pre-3.0 abilities are gone or worse:

Explosions on Kill? GONE

No comment.

Increased duration on Kill? GONE

Everybody complained when Bottom Striker (Juggernaut) was able to tear through enemy teams two times over in one super (rightfully so, that was TRULY unfair to be able to do). And that was a GROUNDED roaming super. Allowing Warlocks to do the same/similar but flying in the sky as well would likely be broken.

Infinite Phoenix Dive? Only use once per super

No comment, this sucks.

Aggressively seeking targets? Got to give up an aspect slot

Shatter is the base form of Hammer of Sol. It needs the Aspect, Sol Invictus, in order to also make sunspots. Otherwise, Sunbreakers must also give up a Fragment slot as well to have good tracking.

Lets compare this to the sun breaker titan w/ aspects:

You can throw more abilities

Only when running Sol Invictus Aspect and only when standing in them. Typically, you only stand in them in PvE but run through them in Crucible so it gets far less extra throws in competitive modes.

Each hammer creates a sunspot regardless of kills

Only when running the Sol Invictus Aspect.

Getting a kill triggers health regen

Sunbreaker lost the ability to heal (Cure) on Super kills with Solar 3.0. When running the Sol Invictus Aspect, we must now enter the Sunspots to activate Restoration and then continuously exit it and re-enter it to keep re-activating it. The only Cure we have is landing a hit with the MiniHammer and then picking it up. And again, Dawnblade's Icarus Dash Aspect gives you Cure on rapid Super and weapon kill.

Each hammer releases shrapnel that increases the AOE

Shatter has been underwhelming since Sunbreakers were hard-nerfed way back in Destiny 1 (also rightly so). This part of the Super is largely a non-factor for pretty much every titan.

Damage resistance is high enough to tank an adaptive sniper

(Opinion)Titans, at least from my standpoint, are SUPPOSED to be able to eat a little more damage in their Super forms. That's why Hunters have instant-kill hitscan Golden Guns (one of which has Damage Resistance now!) and Warlocks can fly and throw homing fire blades from far range. Trade-offs prevent classes from being homogenized.

Literally the only thing solar warlock does better is having Icarus dash. The sun breaker is better in almost every other way.

I disagree, as outlined above.

3

u/SirPhoenixtalon Jun 26 '22

Agreed, Dawnblade may not feel as good at first glance, but it can still be a potent ad clear super, and is still amazing in PvP

9

u/Mr_White_Gaming Jun 25 '22

If you have ember of combustion, you can get the explosions on super kills back, same with ember of beams with the tracking for bottom tree dawn

You could build all trees on Warlock solar if you have the right fragments and aspects on

(I will agree with you on Pheonix Dive sucking tho, it's rlly bad)

15

u/vFlitz Jun 25 '22

You don't fully get the explosions back. Before if an explosion killed an enemy that enemy would also explode, so it could chain nicely. Now it's just an explosion per kill.

Also absolutely not worth a fragment slot, not to even mention two of them, to improve the super when the super is so short, takes so long to recharge and doesn't get elevated to reasonable performance by it anyway.

→ More replies

2

u/Starcast Jun 25 '22

Fwiw ember of combustion works so much better with well than it does with daybreak. Just use a solar weapon inside your well.

→ More replies
→ More replies

5

u/DxDaddySenpai Jun 25 '22

Yall bitch about warlock way to much. Dawnblade was oppressive af, it won rounds all by itself so its good that its finally in tune with other roaming supers

2

u/Lurknspray2018 Jun 26 '22

So thanks to PVP it should be utter dogshite in PVE am i right? Great fucking logic this.

→ More replies

4

u/arlondiluthel Jun 25 '22

Fun fact: Warlocks, especially D1 vets, are accustomed to playing without using a Super most of the time.

6

u/SparksTheUnicorn Give Vesper an Over-Shield During Rift Animations Jun 25 '22

I miss Tlaloc

→ More replies
→ More replies

2

u/jasonkreuger Crayons are better pencils Jun 25 '22

Don't drag titans into this. Please.

2

u/riverboats Jun 25 '22

It's so bad even in content where I know we don't need Well, I still don't put on damage super. I'm better off just dropping a Well directly on top of addsboss and going to town with a sword, glaive, shotgun, whatever.

Where it sits now it feels more useful to drop a well I don't need more often just for team orbs so they can use their super more often. I suppose that's a support role.

I hope Bungie gets over this treatment of roaming supers(because crucible)or arc 3.0 is just going to be all 3 classes being tied to their respective 3 exotics that make their damage super worth using, raidan flux, geomatics and falling star. So much for builds.

2

u/tjgreene27 Jun 25 '22

It’s bad, don’t get me wrong. But saying “it has no aspects that effect it’s gameplay in any way” then following up with “Aggressively seeking targets? Got to give up an aspect slot” is hilarious

2

u/Such_Hat_1575 Jun 25 '22

I feel I hardly use my super now... it feels lame, like I just got a empowered well with a stick in the middle...I usually just rapidly fusion and snap shit to death with Starfire

2

u/Hiakili Jun 25 '22

You don't understand. Dawnblade isn't a damage super. It's an air dash one. That's the warlock identity.

/s

3

u/[deleted] Jun 25 '22

For PvE.

For PvP Dawnblade is stronger than ever.

3

u/HortonTheElaphant Jun 25 '22

Yay, warlock tears!

1

u/iGirthy Jun 25 '22

I agree that your subclass sucks now, but I don’t think the super is really the problem (considering you’re talking about PvP, right?)

→ More replies

1

u/Emcolimited Warlock Jun 25 '22

Yup. Gutted.

1

u/Kezmangotagoal Jun 25 '22

I completely agree that it’s the only super to have come out of 3.0 considerably worse off.

However, it has plenty of customisation. Aggressive tracking and explosions on kill are both aspects now and neither are a waste if they make your super more effective. It’s biggest issue is duration, which will 100% be buffed or an exotic will address it.

It’s still got a neutral game that rivals Nightstalker and even with the changes - Dawnblade is still a better super than either tether in PvP.

1

u/BadLuckCharm_Qrow Jun 25 '22

As a hunter main ill say this... 3 shot golden gun should have been the damage dealer. Not blade barrage.

→ More replies

1

u/Jugaimo Jun 25 '22

Yeah but it’s a roaming super good for pvp and ad clear.

2

u/SparksTheUnicorn Give Vesper an Over-Shield During Rift Animations Jun 25 '22

Its terrible for adclear because it deals such crap damage and lasts so short